It is rare that anyone setup is classic for everyone. I would consider these classic easterly setups. Ok not perfect for all but evidence great synoptics can still occur

While I don't deny the two you've linked have an easterly element, they fail to meet the requirements of a proper easterly.

http://old.wetterzentrale.de/pics/archive/ra/2009/Rrea00120090202.gif

This generated highs of above freezing, so the snow (and there was some) was slushy and soon melted away. Even though 850s looked good there were milder layers of air lower down - due to milder air being dragged in from the Med. The air wasn't sourced from a cold enough area and arrived "pre-mixed".

My weather diary shows max snow depths reached 5 inches, which is certainly impressive by modern standards, but there were no ice days, no icicles and the snow was slushy rather than powdery. (The last two columns are "snow falling?" and "snow depth, in cm, at 6AM"

 

http://old.wetterzentrale.de/pics/archive/ra/2010/Rrea00120101130.gif
Classic easterly setup. Storm of the century for parts of NE Midlands . Appreciate the uppers are not cold enough for the SE coast but perhaps it was too early in the season.

It wasn't too early - and it was the last time we had 6 inches of snow here. It also delivered ice days, which are vanishingly rare here. However (yes, there's a "however") those temperatures still weren't low enough for icicle formation. Somewhat oddly, ground minima (the last numerical column on the chart below) remained close to or above freezing for much of the time, leading to considerable melt despite the copious amounts of snowfall. It chucked it down with rain on the 4th Dec (the lows of the 3rd were in the early evening, before cloud moved in) and that was the death knell.

Compared to say 1996, the last proper midwinter easterly, surface temperatures were a couple of degrees higher - and it seems just over the threshold for powder snow, icicles and so on.

Of course, given the dross of recent years 2010 looks impressive. I'd certainly take it now, even if I'd rather have another 1996 (or 95, 93, 91, 87, 86, 85, 84, 81, 79, 70... the list goes on!)

 

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I think those 2 charts from 2009 and 2010 show more of a 'backdoor' maritime Arctic flow than true continental sourced cold. 

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 With the exception of 2010 and 1981, all recent severe winter spells have occurred in the period 26 December - 23 March, with the incredible March 2013 being the most impressive incarnation recently, laying waste as it did to transport and school for a day or two here on the south coast.

I've seen more decent snow in November than in March - and I would say that 1st Dec-28th Feb more accurately portrays the potential for deep, lasting cold than does 21st Dec-21st Mar. March snow is fleeting and rare in my experience. (March 2013 saw some flurries here but of course there were no ice days... and no more than a dusting of snow.)

The above is why in my view we're in winter now, rather than autumn for another 2 and a bit weeks.

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I've seen more decent snow in November than in March - and I would say that 1st Dec-28th Feb more accurately portrays the potential for deep, lasting cold than does 21st Dec-21st Mar. March snow is fleeting and rare in my experience. (March 2013 saw some flurries here but of course there were no ice days... and no more than a dusting of snow.)

The above is why in my view we're in winter now, rather than autumn for another 2 and a bit weeks.

We are only 4 days into Winter. Surely you have seen more snow from late Dec - right through Feb than November or early Dec? there's a reason for the saying "as the days grow longer the cold grows stronger" - which ties into the "lag effect".

The same can be said about Summer when stunning Summer synoptics rarely happen in June despite having the longest day. Most years July & August are warmer months with a greater chance of a heatwave. It's the reason record high temps have been recorded in those months and not June. In Winter late December in Scotland has the record & not on or before the solstice. And January in England. September often feels warm and not Autumnal, early & mid March often feels cold and wintry with warmth at a premium & not Spring like.

So this lag effect is there all year exept rarer circumstances. So while I see you're point I think you have been on this forum long enough to know full well we have a noticeable lag effect to our climate and decent Winter synoptics don't just happen when the clock strikes midnight on 1st Dec.

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I've seen more decent snow in November than in March - and I would say that 1st Dec-28th Feb more accurately portrays the potential for deep, lasting cold than does 21st Dec-21st Mar. March snow is fleeting and rare in my experience. (March 2013 saw some flurries here but of course there were no ice days... and no more than a dusting of snow.)

The above is why in my view we're in winter now, rather than autumn for another 2 and a bit weeks.

Depends where you live

I have seen more snow in April than I have in November - and excluding 2010, more than I have seen in December.

My lowest temps of the year have (again excluding 2010) more often been in March than Nov or Dec.



Edit: that said, Nov produced my lowest temp since Feb 2012.    This is already my best winter in years!

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I always feel much more at home in the moaning thread, no false hopes looking for faux Easterlies, Greenland highs and memories of winters gone by. Yep you can't beat a good old fashioned British moan about good old fashioned British weather.😎

Unless you're Ian of course then it's all modern. 😂😂😂

The moaning thread is the only sane place to be during a British winter.  I am gutted that the current frosty spell is coming to an end, to be replaced with gut wrenching and sickening mild of unending and dispiriting duration.

The only sensible thing to do under the circumstances is to down a bottle of wine and watch a blockbuster.

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I think those 2 charts from 2009 and 2010 show more of a 'backdoor' maritime Arctic flow than true continental sourced cold. 

Yes that 2010 chart was a dud. Good grief.

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The moaning thread is the only sane place to be during a British winter.  I am gutted that the current frosty spell is coming to an end, to be replaced with gut wrenching and sickening mild of unending and dispiriting duration.

The only sensible thing to do under the circumstances is to down a bottle of wine and watch a blockbuster.

Our fwosty spell consisted of two fwosty mornings, it's been above average temps for the majority of the week........ And this is a cold spell. 😂😂😂😂

Yes that 2010 chart was a dud. Good grief.

 

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I expect some people would find something to moan about with this type of chart. 01 Feb 1956.  Next day -20 uppers in Kent.

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I'm reserving judgment until -

1. We are much further into the winter period
2. I see Richard from Aberdeen post.

Which will be the soonest?

I'm reserving judgment until -

1. We are much further into the winter period
2. I see Richard from Aberdeen post.

Which will be the soonest?

 

I think Richard has already posted in another thread, now his moaning is really first class. 

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The only sensible thing to do under the circumstances is to down a bottle of wine and watch a blockbuster.

 

"I'll have a 'P' please, Bob"

 

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As far as late-autumn/early winter spells go, I can have no complaints. We've had some lovely crisp days with frosts (even some days where the temp has hit 0c by evening) - although most of last week was frost-free as night-time cloud & slightly increased temps put paid to that. Overall, I reckon we've had around 10 frosts over the last 3 weeks.

If this is a hors d'oeuvre for some better winter weather (OK, I mean snow & prolonged cold to keep it in situ for a couple/few weeks) then it would be a tasty treat to be fondly remembered in the context of a fabulous festive feast.

However, if it turns out to be the main course, or is only followed by another frosty-but-dry amuse-bouche, then it will leave a big, gaping gap in my nourishment, an appetite unfulfilled.

 

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"I'll have a 'P' please, Bob"

 

😂👌

Maybe we can coin a new phrase: 'This winter has done a right Bob Holness?' 

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The only sensible thing to do under the circumstances is to down a bottle of wine and watch a blockbuster.

 

But make sure you've opened the windows and turned the aircon on full blast  otherwise you'll think it's June. The next 7 to 10 days look a pathetic excuse for mid December.

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But make sure you've opened the windows and turned the aircon on full blast  otherwise you'll think it's June. The next 7 to 10 days look a pathetic excuse for mid December.

 BRILLIANT !!!!! now that's funny.

I'm putting it out there now in that I think they'll be no lowland snow for the majority of UK this year. I'm also wondering on what the odds are for any of the major cities not seeing lying snow for the duration of this winter, might be worth a punt.

 

 

But make sure you've opened the windows and turned the aircon on full blast  otherwise you'll think it's June. The next 7 to 10 days look a pathetic excuse for mid December.

If it is going to be mild then let it be exceptionally so from an extremes point of view. 10C in December just doesn't hold much interest.

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