A serious question for you Richard: Are you EVER happy with any of the weather you get these days?

What is there ever to be happy about these days? Wet, cloudy summers and frost-free, snowless winters don't appeal to me in the slightest and that's all we ever get.

Sadly it wouldn't at all surprise me if today's snow is more than there is at any point over the winter. I said a year ago that the frosty spell in November was as good as it would get and was proved correct then.

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What is there ever to be happy about these days? Wet, cloudy summers and frost-free, snowless winters don't appeal to me in the slightest and that's all we ever get.

Sadly it wouldn't at all surprise me if today's snow is more than there is at any point over the winter. I said a year ago that the frosty spell in November was as good as it would get and was proved correct then.

Yep! I knew that it wouldn't be long before normal service was resumed here, otherwise these threads just probably wouldn't be the same.

For me, what I am about to share is more of a gloat than a moan because we now have two nights in a row where there has been an air frost at the botanic gardens in Edinburgh.

I have been guilty quite recently of complaining about the temperatures not dropping quickly enough or not dropping at all (or in some cases, even going up when they should be dropping). Looking back at my own statistics though, I have discovered that the number of air frosts at my three local stations has actually been above the 1981-2010 average so I don't really have anything to complain about on that score, as long as this then doesn't end up being "it" for our winter.

That is always a possibility as milder air is forecast to move in from tomorrow night and the return of the northerlies after that is now being further delayed all the time and even downgraded in a number of models to being more of a transient cold snap before the next milder spell moves in.

if it does get milder and stay that way for much of the winter, there are only two possible benefits from that which I can see. First of all, that would reduce my heating bills a bit. Secondly, that would probably come with the weather becoming more unsettled. Hopefully, that wouldn't mean a return to really mild, wet and stormy weather as there is always a risk that this could happen. However, it has been very dry here recently and so any rainfall which came from that would probably be very much welcome and much needed rainfall as a result.

 

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This one has to be worthy of a gloat but it emphasises the very strange nature of our weather just now, and how it can be hard to fathom all of that out.

Now a few days ago, we were in a northerly air mass from the Arctic, but where the temperature quite often refused to drop at night and this meant that we didn't actually get as many air frosts from that as you would expect from that sort of air mass.

Tonight on the other hand, we have had a warm front move through from the north-west which has introduced what is supposed to be "milder" air mass. In recent winters, it would have been an absolutely stone wall guarantee that this would have resulted in the wind picking up from the south or south-west with the temperatures then shooting up to such insanely high values during the night that on many occasions, it would actually be warmer even in the middle of winter than on many occasions during the summer.

On this occasion though, that hasn't happened. These are two entirely different air masses which I am talking about here in yet, the temperature just now is turning out to be not all that different in both cases, and is even behaving in virtually the same way. The dew points have now all gone above freezing, but the fact they were below freezing before is the only thing which you can actually use to identify that as a "warm" front.

This in turn, has to be good news for those of us who want a cold winter. In those really mild recent winters, the lowest maximum temperatures here in one of the few relatively cold spells which we got would be around the 7°C mark. In a cold winter, that would be the sort of maximum temperatures which we could get in one of the few relatively mild spells which we got during those winters. At the moment, I'm seeing the maximum temperatures being forecast to be not much more than that over this over the next few days within what is supposed to be a relatively mild spell of weather.

That is something which I haven't witnessed for quite a number of years and so, that surely has to raise some hopes at least that we could well have finally entered into a decent cold winter for once. That doesn't necessarily mean that this will be a repeat of we saw in 2010 but at the moment, I would say that things are actually looking quite good in that department just now.

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Any other southerners getting board of seeing the northerners & Scots get excited about the prospect of some snow? Feeling a bit underwhelmed about a chilly but not that cold N/NW wind.

Any other southerners getting board of seeing the northerners & Scots get excited about the prospect of some snow? Feeling a bit underwhelmed about a chilly but not that cold N/NW wind.

No, not bored but more resigned. Already people are bringing out the old cliches like it being "bitterly cold".... if a high of 3C with a breeze is "bitterly cold", what on earth would they describe the "good old days" of -2C by day with a gale force easterly as?

Similarly, talk of widespread snow... yes, we could roll a triple 6 and see widespread lowland snow down here in the south, but even if we do get some - with temperatures a few degrees above zero by day it'd melt PDQ.

That's northerlies for you though (or NW'lies, as they're more likely to be by the time they reach here). What I wouldn't give for a midwinter easterly... it'll have been 21 years this winter since the last one. Surely the drought has to end sooner or later, doesn't it?...

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No, not bored but more resigned. Already people are bringing out the old cliches like it being "bitterly cold".... if a high of 3C with a breeze is "bitterly cold", what on earth would they describe the "good old days" of -2C by day with a gale force easterly as?

Similarly, talk of widespread snow... yes, we could roll a triple 6 and see widespread lowland snow down here in the south, but even if we do get some - with temperatures a few degrees above zero by day it'd melt PDQ.

That's northerlies for you though (or NW'lies, as they're more likely to be by the time they reach here). What I wouldn't give for a midwinter easterly... it'll have been 21 years this winter since the last one. Surely the drought has to end sooner or later, doesn't it?...

By today's standards a max of 3c with a strong wind is often as good as it gets cold-wise. With the odd exceptional day that might get to zero. So its all relative.  Those days of -4 maxes in the teeth of an easterly or north easterly as I saw in 1972,1978,  1979, 1982, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1991, 1996 and 1997 are I fear, consigned to a bygone era, before the Arctic and Polar regions warmed.

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By today's standards a max of 3c with a strong wind is often as good as it gets cold-wise. With the odd exceptional day that might get to zero. So its all relative.  Those days of -4 maxes in the teeth of an easterly or north easterly as I saw in 1972,1978,  1979, 1982, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1991, 1996 and 1997 are I fear, consigned to a bygone era, before the Arctic and Polar regions warmed.

 Sadly if you like cold weather i think you are right. It just does not get as cold now. 

 

No, not bored but more resigned. Already people are bringing out the old cliches like it being "bitterly cold".... if a high of 3C with a breeze is "bitterly cold", what on earth would they describe the "good old days" of -2C by day with a gale force easterly as?

Similarly, talk of widespread snow... yes, we could roll a triple 6 and see widespread lowland snow down here in the south, but even if we do get some - with temperatures a few degrees above zero by day it'd melt PDQ.

That's northerlies for you though (or NW'lies, as they're more likely to be by the time they reach here). What I wouldn't give for a midwinter easterly... it'll have been 21 years this winter since the last one. Surely the drought has to end sooner or later, doesn't it?...

A high of 3C wow that would be nice from a northerly here as it' difficult to get a max much lower then 5C down here.

Dry chilly winds with scenes of snow from favoured coastal locations with the outside hopes of a rogue overnight flurry - many a year of desperation has left me depleted. 

And yes as you say, any widespread lowland snow from back edge stuff would be very temporary before it either melted or froze into a death trap. 

I remember the bitter easterly winds of the early & mid 90's but even they failed to deliver decent snow cover here. 

 

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I remember the bitter easterly winds of the early & mid 90's but even they failed to deliver decent snow cover here. 

Portsmouth is a notorious snow desert.  You used to be able to rely on a 'channel runner' but the atmosphere has warmed to the wrong side of marginal.  I'm not quite saying game over, but game very much less frequent and much much more difficult.

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One thing that does grate on me slightly is those who poo-poo others snow chances just because they themselves aren’t living in a favourable area this time around. 

It may come to absolutely nothing towards the end of the week, but for many of those areas where the outlook currently looks promising, it’s the same areas that don’t very often get snow (ie lowland Western Britain). Give us a sodding chance. 😀

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One thing that does grate on me slightly is those who poo-poo others snow chances just because they themselves aren’t living in a favourable area this time around. 

It may come to absolutely nothing towards the end of the week, but for many of those areas where the outlook currently looks promising, it’s the same areas that don’t very often get snow (ie lowland Western Britain). Give us a sodding chance. 😀

Now you’ve jinxed it. 😂😂😂

Now you’ve jinxed it. 😂😂😂

It may well come to absolutely nothing. 😉😉

Not denying that at all! 😀

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This morning's ECM summary for the south:

Thursday: Woo! Wind and rain!
Friday: Cold and dry
Saturday: Cold and dry
Sunday: Cold and dry to start, then cloud and mild gunk moving in
Monday: Woo! More wind and rain!
Tuesday: Just for a change, wet and windy!

Pff.

Still (he says, with imperfect grace) at least some parts of the UK are in for a fair bit of snow. If I was in the NW of England (or Scotland, or Wales, or NI) I'd be much more excited.

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This morning's ECM summary for the south:

Thursday: Woo! Wind and rain!
Friday: Cold and dry
Saturday: Cold and dry
Sunday: Cold and dry to start, then cloud and mild gunk moving in
Monday: Woo! More wind and rain!
Tuesday: Just for a change, wet and windy!

Pff.

Still (he says, with imperfect grace) at least some parts of the UK are in for a fair bit of snow. If I was in the NW of England (or Scotland, or Wales, or NI) I'd be much more excited.

I’ve a feeling you’ll be more excited after mid month with heights over Scandinavia becoming more prevalent with time, just a hunch but some of the output in the outer reaches of FI are indicating such. Hopefully you’ll see your nirvana this winter Retron. IMBY Easterlies rarely deliver without an attack from the Atlantic which often ends with a couple of hours snow before the milder air wins out, the exceptions being 78/79 and 95/96.

A golden rule to remember is that the prospect and expectation of snow are generally more enjoyable than the reality. 

I didn't want to go off topic in the MO thread by replying so have put this here, and so true what Brian says and it's the reason I view the forum almost Daily through Autumn/Winter ......it's the fun of the chase and hope  

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One thing that does grate on me slightly is those who poo-poo others snow chances just because they themselves aren’t living in a favourable area this time around. 

It may come to absolutely nothing towards the end of the week, but for many of those areas where the outlook currently looks promising, it’s the same areas that don’t very often get snow (ie lowland Western Britain). Give us a sodding chance. 😀

 

As someone who hates others getting snow when I don't, I've no moral high-ground to stand on. But it does make reading the MO thread really confusing when you see a succession of posts claiming the output is rubbish and there's no chance of snow - only to then look at the charts and go, "eh?".

Anyway, another gripe is people perpetuating the myth that this region does badly for snow.   Seriously, I'm being a bit IMBY'ist here, but in recent years my neck of the woods seems to have fared as well as another other lowland area in England. I know from first-hand experience that Manchester has missed out on about half the snowfalls St Helens has had (and SC tells us that Blackburn has missed out on a few, too - even though my colleague from Accrington claims to have been hit by 'half a foot' of snow every winter...) but I struggle to complain - we even had a surprise 3 inches or so fall on Boxing Day evening a couple of years back. There was a time when I used to feel we missed out a bit, but that was when easterlies (or straight northerlies, which are dry here) seemed to predominate. Thankfully, we've had enough episodes of cold NW'ly flows to help deliver.

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I didn't want to go off topic in the MO thread by replying so have put this here, and so true what Brian says and it's the reason I view the forum almost Daily through Autumn/Winter ......it's the fun of the chase and hope  

What you and Brian gave said is utter silliness.

It's like looking forward to a nice cold pint down the pub at the end of the week only to be served water - and being content with water.

 

 

As someone who hates others getting snow when I don't, I've no moral high-ground to stand on. But it does make reading the MO thread really confusing when you see a succession of posts claiming the output is rubbish and there's no chance of snow - only to then look at the charts and go, "eh?".

Anyway, another gripe is people perpetuating the myth that this region does badly for snow.   Seriously, I'm being a bit IMBY'ist here, but in recent years my neck of the woods seems to have fared as well as another other lowland area in England. I know from first-hand experience that Manchester has missed out on about half the snowfalls St Helens has had (and SC tells us that Blackburn has missed out on a few, too - even though my colleague from Accrington claims to have been hit by 'half a foot' of snow every winter...) but I struggle to complain - we even had a surprise 3 inches or so fall on Boxing Day evening a couple of years back. There was a time when I used to feel we missed out a bit, but that was when easterlies (or straight northerlies, which are dry here) seemed to predominate. Thankfully, we've had enough episodes of cold NW'ly flows to help deliver.

Lol, I forgot about your work colleague who apparently lives in his own microclimate. Joking aside I hate reading others stories of a winter wonderland outside their back yard whilst I’m staring down the abyss of another failed attempt at what passes for a U.K. winter. 😎

 

What you and Brian gave said is utter silliness.

It's like looking forward to a nice cold pint down the pub at the end of the week only to be served water - and being content with water.

Was the chase for 2010 better than the actual event? perhaps not for me as it was fantastic however for some even my region (SE) ithat wasn't the case.....BUT more often than not the chase is better because the event doesn't always live up to the chase.

I bet you thinking about your pint at the pub helps you to get through the working week?

 

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 Sadly if you like cold weather i think you are right. It just does not get as cold now. 

We managed some subzero maxima in late March in 2013 down here in Hampshire, so with the same synoptics in midwinter I'm sure -4C maxes would be possible!

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