Was the chase for 2010 better than the actual event? perhaps not for me as it was fantastic however for some even my region (SE) ithat wasn't the case.....BUT more often than not the chase is better because the event doesn't always live up to the chase.

I bet you thinking about your pint at the pub helps you to get through the working week?

 

2010 delivered but for the most part was a non event down here... 3 day cold spell with snow.

I work shifts and often work weekends so no, I used it as an example.

 

2010 delivered but for the most part was a non event down here... 3 day cold spell with snow.

 

 

Seriously?

---

 

2010 delivered but for the most part was a non event down here... 3 day cold spell with snow.

I work shifts and often work weekends so no, I used it as an example.

 

The weather Almanac tells a different story

 

https://www.timeanddate.com/weather/uk/portsmouth/historic?month=12&year=2010

 

you had snow at the start of the month, followed by a week before christmas of temps getting no higher than 1*c with some snow.

 

Probably not much snow about - ill give you that.  But that was a similar story up in Wirral.  Every where got upwards of 10-15Cm.  we got about 8cm over a few days.  What was notable for us though was the temps and the longevity, along with watching the weather forecast on BBC and being aware of the literal country wide impact.  I think the worst affected areas were eastern britain and central southern england.

---

This morning's ECM summary for the south:

Thursday: Woo! Wind and rain!
Friday: Cold and dry
Saturday: Cold and dry
Sunday: Cold and dry to start, then cloud and mild gunk moving in
Monday: Woo! More wind and rain!
Tuesday: Just for a change, wet and windy!

Pff.

Still (he says, with imperfect grace) at least some parts of the UK are in for a fair bit of snow. If I was in the NW of England (or Scotland, or Wales, or NI) I'd be much more excited.

 

Unfortunatly those of us in the North west England dont typically do well from these setups.  They should on paper be the same as a north easterly for the north east.  Collecting all that wintry Precip

 

Apart from we dont.  Central and hilly areas do well.  But not the North west.

 

Why?

 

Sea temps

 

Of say the last .. what 20 winter northwesterly winds that have blown through here... I would say maybe 2-3 have produced snow.

 

Its usually Gruapal, Hail sleet, or rain.  Very very rarely snow,

 

Those showers then move on through to cheshire gap and relax into more of a typical snow shower. Stoke and Crewe are typically snowfields after a day.  Look over to North wales, and they have snow on the coast.  Over to North east England on on North easterly... they have snow on the coast.

 

Not us.

 

This week will be no different. 

---

 

 

The weather Almanac tells a different story

 

https://www.timeanddate.com/weather/uk/portsmouth/historic?month=12&year=2010

 

you had snow at the start of the month, followed by a week before christmas of temps getting no higher than 1*c with some snow.

 

Probably not much snow about - ill give you that.  But that was a similar story up in Wirral.  Every where got upwards of 10-15Cm.  we got about 8cm over a few days.  What was notable for us though was the temps and the longevity, along with watching the weather forecast on BBC and being aware of the literal country wide impact.  I think the worst affected areas were eastern britain and central southern england.

Thats not for Portsmouth and nor is it accurate. Oh and Portsmouth did see widely 5 - 6 inches of powdery snow.

Dec 08 into Jan 09 was a much better uninterrupted  colder spell.

Any other southerners getting board of seeing the northerners & Scots get excited about the prospect of some snow? Feeling a bit underwhelmed about a chilly but not that cold N/NW wind.

bored? No, we have only just started Winter and I witnessed snow in Autumn. That Cold ( windchill ) will feel Cold in my opinion by Friday even in my neck of the woods.

---

 

Unfortunatly those of us in the North west England dont typically do well from these setups.  They should on paper be the same as a north easterly for the north east.  Collecting all that wintry Precip

 

Apart from we dont.  Central and hilly areas do well.  But not the North west.

 

Why?

 

Sea temps

 

Of say the last .. what 20 winter northwesterly winds that have blown through here... I would say maybe 2-3 have produced snow.

 

Its usually Gruapal, Hail sleet, or rain.  Very very rarely snow,

 

Those showers then move on through to cheshire gap and relax into more of a typical snow shower. Stoke and Crewe are typically snowfields after a day.  Look over to North wales, and they have snow on the coast.  Over to North east England on on North easterly... they have snow on the coast.

 

Not us.

 

This week will be no different. 

 

It's not as uniform as you make out for the NW. I've had numerous occasions of receiving snow from NW'lies. Yes, showers of snow are interspersed with showers of graupel/pellets (hell, even single showers transition between the two) but it's still fine as far as I'm concerned. It all leaves the ground white.

A cold NW'ly flow is actually one I'd look favourably on, as it more often than not delivers here.

---

 

 

It's not as uniform as you make out for the NW. I've had numerous occasions of receiving snow from NW'lies. Yes, showers of snow are interspersed with showers of graupel/pellets (hell, even single showers transition between the two) but it's still fine as far as I'm concerned. It all leaves the ground white.

A cold NW'ly flow is actually one I'd look favourably on, as it more often than not delivers here.

My thoughts too Saint.

For the Wirral & the coast though uppers need to be at or below -10C to guarantee snow, it's not quite as crucial inland.

---

 

Thats not for Portsmouth and nor is it accurate. Oh and Portsmouth did see widely 5 - 6 inches of powdery snow.

Dec 08 into Jan 09 was a much better uninterrupted  colder spell.

True winter weather only really comes in this part of the south with a direct easterly from a bitterly cold continent, then the south is the coldest part of the uk, even on the coast.  Shanklin Isle of Wight's maximum of -7C in Jan 87 is testimony to that. ...but as rare as....it was so dry it was difficult to tell if it was fine sand or snow drifting on the seafront. 

 

Thats not for Portsmouth and nor is it accurate. Oh and Portsmouth did see widely 5 - 6 inches of powdery snow.

Dec 08 into Jan 09 was a much better uninterrupted  colder spell.

Can't really speak for your part of the world but I do recall Dec 2010 being a bit touch and go for me at times and I'm further East and with a bit of height to help. I actually did really well for snow out of some of the LPs rolling past but there were a few hours of sleety stuff with some melting involved before the lows pulled away and reintroduced some colder air again. I think the higher DP air that made things briefly 'iffy' for me was much more of an issue further West and lower down, which is also why some of my fellow Kent types don't have too much affection for that month.

It was for me though one of the best prolonged cold spells I've experienced albeit we never quite managed the real depths of cold that we have done from Easterly spells. (Snowfall was great in my neck of the woods, with several big falls).

---

What I remember 2010 for were the several bouts of freezing drizzle we had around our parts- it caused chaos. The local council had run out of grit and it was just lethal. Some snow fell too and we had some impressive low minima, but the largest snowfall of about 3 inches only added to an overall snow depth of about 6 or 7 inches max, paltry compared to the epic easterlies of the 60's 70's and 80's where snow drifts could be measured by feet not inches.

Dec 2010 was a far better winter month than the grey easterly rubbish of the 80s. We had a max of -5C here, in a location where ice days are not common, and when they do occur are seldom colder than -1C. Snow reached a greater depth than at any point during the 80s as was also the case in February 1999 and March 2006.

It’s the minimum temperatures that aren’t as cold. There just always seems to be an irritating breeze preventing temperatures falling as much. This is in the east in particular as Northern Ireland saw record lows reached during 2010.

Last week’s northerly gave a max of 2C here on Thursday, which is no different to what I would have expected in the past. However the temperature then failed to drop below 1.2C overnight despite 5cm of snow remaining. That is a complete and utter joke. Just seems that no matter what the synoptics, temperatures remain virtually static by day and night only changing when milder air moves in or with the passage of a cold front.

So far this month has been as dire as the last two Decembers with no frost. Hasn’t even dropped below 5C since Saturday morning and the first week looks as though it will finish one of the mildest on record. Temperatures look like getting well into double figures overnight I therefore am far from convinced that a decent cold spell will ensue.

---

Well I for one ain't in the slightest looking forward to the end of this week, and I will be making the most of the next two days. All I can hope is that any snow showers steer well clear of here and we have a slight breeze to stop the nights becoming too cold.

---

Unless we see a more Westerly element to the NW on Friday/Saturday then this part of the world could continue its snowless path now into its seventh year, bar the odd rogue flake of snow or two. Still lots to play for but we’ve missed out a number of NW due to the winds having a more Northerly element to them, will this buck the trend.

Unless we see a more Westerly element to the NW on Friday/Saturday then this part of the world could continue its snowless path now into its seventh year, bar the odd rogue flake of snow or two. Still lots to play for but we’ve missed out a number of NW due to the winds having a more Northerly element to them, will this buck the trend.

Same here. I think there will be the odd flake but nothing significant.  It's possible sometimes there will be a rogue batch of showers but generally they have to pass through Morecombe Bay or Cumbria which is more unusual.  

Not too fused though had some small amounts of snow from the NW and NE so far this autumn and there will be other opportunities. Will be good to see those in the southern part of the NW get some snow.

 

---

There are many reasons why I remember December 2010 very well. What I found was even then, we wouldn't get any snow from any of the northerlies which were around then even though there were a number of places which were still getting snow from that. However, there was more than enough decent proper easterlies around then to more than compensate for that. We had a lot of snow here in March 2013 and that is still the last time that even the north of Edinburgh (which is right on the coast) had quite deep snow cover.

That lasted for only a short period of time though and so, we haven't actually had any deep snow here since December 2010 which has actually lasted for any length of time. That snowfall would of course, come from those easterlies and there was always enough of that left over when the next northerly came along to ensure that this lasted for quite a while. The only problem back then was that this snow had largely turned to ice by then, making it very difficult to get around.

Once we got to the winter of 2012/13, we had a lot of snowfall then as well from those easterlies which produced a lot of deep snow away from the coast but the difference then was the snow just didn't lie here where I live because as well as having to get that easterly in the first place, you then have to somehow hope that there isn't too much of a moderation of that air mass right on the coast due to that wind coming from the relatively warm North Sea (such as what we had back in February) and that is a very difficult to act to actually pull off.

As for this month (and indeed this winter) we had a slight air frost on the very first day of this month but that is all we have had so far and in fact, our minimum temperatures have been steadily increasing during each day since then with every single day so far, giving us our highest minimum temperature of both the month and winter so far with that one night where we did get an air frost being the only occasion so far where the temperature dropped to below 4°C. On one night, we did get a minimum temperature of -4°C at Edinburgh Airport. However, that happened during November which is part of the autumn and so, we now have a situation just now where our lowest temperature of the overall autumn/winter season didn't even happen during the actual winter. When you add all of that up, this is not exactly the sort of start to the winter which any coldie in this part of the world would have hoped for so far.

EDIT:

I forgot to add as well that whilst we might well have a cold snap coming up at the end of the week, one thing which is certain is that we're probably yet again, not going to get any snow from that here in Edinburgh and of course, I've no doubt that it will probably be too windy again for much in the way of frost if anything at all. This means that even that probably isn't going to be that exciting here and whilst it might not be quite as bad as what we have seen in recent years, this winter is still in my books, developing into a bit of a non-event just now, yet again.

 

---

I've got to hand it to You John, if Brian did an award for the longest posts you'd win by a country mile 

---

I've got to hand it to You John, if Brian did an award for the longest posts you'd win by a country mile 

Yes, but I do realise that there is an actual limit to what you can enter into each post (I think that this limit is 32767 characters per post) which is why when I'm giving a detailed summary for both Edinburgh Gogarbank and the botanic gardens in Edinburgh over on the precipitation watch threads, I always split that into two separate posts so that each of these posts can then deal with each of those stations in isolation.

 

---

Utterly vile yet again. Just came out of work to find it raining - not forecast or even on the radar 

Looks like it will be the mildest first week of winter since 1974 here or even longer than that. Just absolutely dire with the temperature not dropping below 4C in over four days yet feeling cold every day and failing to reach 10C.

If you look at previous very mild spells they were nowhere near as stupefyingly boring as this. There is basically no diurnal range at all whereas in 1974 the minima were far cooler, and maxima milder, with diurnal ranges up to 10C.

https://en.tutiempo.net/climate/12-1974/ws-30910.html 

Same in 1979 – very mild start but with far more temperature variation.

https://en.tutiempo.net/climate/12-1979/ws-30910.html 

and the same again in 1988

https://en.tutiempo.net/climate/12-1988/ws-30910.html 

You hardly see any days in there with the 2-3C, or lower, diurnal ranges that are so common nowadays. In the past you got that from easterlies now it’s everything.

Look at this and you see only one day out of the last five that exhibits normal diurnal variation:

http://www.weathercast.co.uk/world-weather/weather-stations/obsid/3091.html 

The 2010s is truly the decade the weather died. It is the lack of temperature variation I despise more than the mild temperatures. Mind numbing beyond comprehension

 

---

Now, I really don't like the way that this winter is going. At the moment, we have double figure temperatures to such an extent there were a number of days even during the summer which weren't much warmer than that. This means that basically, this winter so far has been just the same old story in terms of what other recent winters have been like, and is every bit as bad at the moment for those of us who just want to see some cold weather.

We do have some cold weather coming up, but this is basically just going to be in the form of dry NW winds once Storm Caroline moves out of the way. This means that yet again, Edinburgh will be missing out on any snow which other parts of the country will be getting and once again, it will probably still be too windy for an air frost. Now, even this promise of a slider low on Sunday is going out of the window as that continues to get pushed further south on the various forecast models. These things tend to happen in one of two ways because when they come further north, it tends to just be places north of the Central Belt which gets any of the snow which means that we then just end up getting a lot of rain here. The other scenario is that it goes too far south for us to get anything from that at all, and this is now looking like the most likely outcome.

Here, I can see a lot of southerners rejoicing in the fact that they might get some action from that, but my question here is why on Earth should it always be people in the south of the UK which gets all of the fun when it comes to our weather? If you go back to six months ago to the early part of the summer, I didn't hear anyone in the south complaining when they were basking in temperatures up into the mid 30s whilst here in Edinburgh, we were experiencing our wettest June on record. To me, it would therefore only be fair if those fortunes were reversed sometimes and it is time that people in the south of England realised that. In a fair world, everyone has to have their turn of getting the fun at some point in time and people have to realise that this will mean that everyone will also have to have a shot of missing out on that fun at some point in time, which other people are getting.

At the moment, we have had a very dry start to the winter and although we might get some rain later on courtesy of Storm Caroline, that is unlikely to be enough to prevent the rainfall totals from still being well below average once that event has passed. if we don't get that slider low on Sunday or the one after that, these rainfall deficits are just going to keep piling up even further. All I can then see ahead is a really dry winter and then what's the betting that nearly all of the rainfall then gets saved up for next summer, just as it was this year?

---