The Weather Outlook

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Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
17 December 2024 14:49:51

With the main focus on Xmas, this is one that's crept up on people. 

GFS always overeggs the snow threat, but it's showing snow to even low levels across NW England, N Wales (as well as much of Scotland). I don't think that'll happen (more likely just wintry showers) - but areas over 500ft could/should get a covering

I'm tempted by a pre-Xmas walk in the Lakes with my family & dog on Sunday... 

Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 

I think it could get quite bad; lake effect off a warm atlantic has more convective potential than that off the north sea anyway; and this is a deep cold core low with all the variables looking favourable. On higher ground we are probably looking at feet of snow and inches to favoured spots at lower levels is not inprobable.


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
18 December 2024 10:25:28
UKV showing some of these heavy snow showers getting to low levels in NW England on Sunday morning.

Legit think some people are going to be taken aback by this. For all the talk of a mild xmas, sunday has alot of snow potential for some.  

I personally expect to add to my snow diary (sig) even though I'm not expecting meaningful amounts. Some favoured spots could see alot though.


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

Dickieboy68
18 December 2024 16:53:45
 ---- agreed, my gfs 0600 snow row has suddenly shot up to 17 for Sunday morning - beats the sum of the rest of the output altogether!!
Dickieboy - In the deep mid-Wiltshire 85m ASL

Formerly Guest (16) since 2004

Boardshark
19 December 2024 12:59:47
ours has shot up to 25 for Sunday now.  
449ft Sutton Coldfield, West MIdlands
Jiries
19 December 2024 18:22:43

ours has shot up to 25 for Sunday now.  

Originally Posted by: Boardshark 

Possible Cheshire Gap for the Midlands area just need the temps below 0 to support that.

tierradelfuego
19 December 2024 19:04:53

ours has shot up to 25 for Sunday now.  

Originally Posted by: Boardshark 

"only" 19 down here in Berkshire.

I remember back in either 2017/2018 (not home to confirm which) where we had a few December snow events all from a NW direction, Cheshire gap on steroids is required.

As much as many would think the GFS is overdoing it, I wouldn't put out of the realms of possibility given the strength of the NWer. 0c is not required when a lake effect can get this far inland.


Bucklebury

West Berkshire Downs AONB

135m ASL

VP2 with daytime FARS

Rainfall collector separated at ground level

Anemometer separated above roof level

WeatherLink Live (Byles Green Crew )

Tim A
21 December 2024 20:31:58
Met Office app shows heavy snow showers at 1c here first thing. With the strength of the wind the showers will rattle through quickly so doubt they will accumulate.  
Tim

NW Leeds

187m asl

 My PWS 

Tim A
22 December 2024 08:27:25
Hills look white above 300 metres to the SW.. Possibly lower in the Dales as they have caught some heavy showers. Wet snow showers at my altitude. 1c now . 
Tim

NW Leeds

187m asl

 My PWS 

Crepuscular Ray
22 December 2024 09:16:19

Hills look white above 300 metres to the SW.. Possibly lower in the Dales as they have caught some heavy showers. Wet snow showers at my altitude. 1c now . 

Originally Posted by: Tim A 

Always remember seeing the hills white above Bradford when I lived in Yeadon, Tim.

Queensbury, Shelf, Denholme. Some of the highest suburbs in England 😄


Jerry

Edinburgh, in the frost hollow below Blackford Hill

Tim A
22 December 2024 10:24:43

Always remember seeing the hills white above Bradford when I lived in Yeadon, Tim.

Queensbury, Shelf, Denholme. Some of the highest suburbs in England 😄

Originally Posted by: Crepuscular Ray 

Indeed, sadly in recent years they have had far less snow than they used to.  These type of westerly wintry showers seem less frequent. 

Just had a very heavy shower which dropped the temp to 0.4c and resulted in a slushy covering on most surfaces. 


Tim

NW Leeds

187m asl

 My PWS 

Ally Pally Snowman
22 December 2024 10:31:48
Some Christmassy scenes in the Peak district. 

https://www.jamesgphotography.co.uk/peak-district-webcams/#catandfiddle 


Bishop's Stortford 85m ASL.
Saint Snow
22 December 2024 12:07:32
Very minimal lying snow from last night's efforts; snow line in the Lakes, Pennines and Snowdonia higher than I'd expected (1500 feet'ish?)

Martin

Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)

A TWO addict since 14/12/01

"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."

Aneurin Bevan

Northern Sky
22 December 2024 12:53:27

Indeed, sadly in recent years they have had far less snow than they used to.  These type of westerly wintry showers seem less frequent. 

Just had a very heavy shower which dropped the temp to 0.4c and resulted in a slushy covering on most surfaces. 

Originally Posted by: Tim A 

I went over to Otley this morning and the roads had a covering. It looked beautiful on the Chevin but I was a little wary driving down the other side into Otley! 

Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
28 December 2024 06:02:58
One day left until snow starts to fall in the far N of Scotland.

Snow becoming a bit more widespread later on NYE and into NYD. By then I'd expect places like Altnahara to have 50cm+ of snow. Somewhere like Wick or Kirkwell could easily be 20cm+


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
28 December 2024 06:12:33
https://www.theweatheroutlook.com/charts/ukv/03_84_snow_depth.png 

This is just insane. Got to be a red level warning for that top left corner surely? 70cm+ falling over only a few days.

UserPostedImage


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

doctormog
28 December 2024 06:44:43

https://www.theweatheroutlook.com/charts/ukv/03_84_snow_depth.png

This is just insane. Got to be a red level warning for that top left corner surely? 70cm+ falling over only a few days.

UserPostedImage

Originally Posted by: Quantum 

I would doubt it, due to the low population.  


Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
28 December 2024 08:10:46

I would doubt it, due to the low population.  

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

Doesnt it increase the risk these populations will be cut off?


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

Tim A
28 December 2024 08:38:01
Been looking at cottages in the far North for New Year , unsurprisingly not much availability, but would be a great place to see in the New Year. 
Tim

NW Leeds

187m asl

 My PWS 

doctormog
28 December 2024 09:30:25

Doesnt it increase the risk these populations will be cut off?

Originally Posted by: Quantum 

It’s possible but not that many people live in the far northwest of Scotland. It does look as if it will get very snowy up there but I doubt it will get much coverage due to the very inaccessibility you mention. 


Retron
28 December 2024 09:39:37

It’s possible but not that many people live in the far northwest of Scotland. It does look as if it will get very snowy up there but I doubt it will get much coverage due to the very inaccessibility you mention. 

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

Indeed, having looked it up on Wiki the population of the entire Highland area (which includes the far NW) is only 235,710 - and that's over an area of 9905 square miles. The article on Wiki mentions it's a ninth of the entire UK land area and it's larger than Wales!

In comparison the Medway Towns here in Kent (a conurbation of 5 towns, including Rochester, Strood, Gillingham, Chatham and Rainham) is just over 280,000 - and that's in an area of just 74 square miles.

The Highlands are, I would suggest, the closest we have to a true wilderness in the UK.


Leysdown, north Kent
doctormog
28 December 2024 09:49:37
Sutherland, the area that may be most affected has a population of just over 12800.

For comparison Aberdeen is similar to your part of the world Darren with an area of 72 square miles and population circa 225000 (so a bit less than your locality). 

For a city it has a relatively low population density and some nice open spaces. 


doctormog
28 December 2024 11:20:33
The Met Office weather warning has been updated to reflect the changing picture on Monday and Tuesday and I suspect it may be updated again when the certainty is higher (tomorrow):

“Heavy rain will become persistent and widespread during Monday and Tuesday. Widespread totals of 50 to 70mm are possible over the two days with some places perhaps seeing 100 to 140mm of rain, these higher totals most likely over western Scotland.

North and east of (and including) Perthshire, precipitation is likely to fall as snow, especially over high ground, with 10-20cm accumulating above 150-200 meters, with several cm accumulating at lower elevations away from windward coasts. As milder air pushes in, snow will turn back to rain, and any rapid snow melt will contribute to flooding in places.

Strong winds may exacerbate impacts, particularly across the areas of Scotland affected by snow. Blizzard conditions are possible, especially over high ground and across much of Sutherland and Caithness. Powerline icing is possible where blizzard conditions occur.”

https://weather.metoffice.gov.uk/warnings-and-advice/uk-warnings#?date=2024-12-30 


aesmith
28 December 2024 17:05:07
It's definitely looking worryingly unpleasant. I think heavy rain before and after heavy snow is probably much worse than if it all fell as snow. Locally we're in a bit of a rain shadow,  so can just hope for a bit less than forecast.  


-------------

Tony S

Now only 180m ASL

Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
28 December 2024 19:00:16
So we now have a big potential snow event on NYD. This needs watching closely.


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

Zubzero
28 December 2024 22:31:52
Most people and the media suffer from severe imbyisem. 

Would be more attention and posts about a dusting in the Southern England then what is expected to happen in the coming cold spell. 

https://modeles16.meteociel.fr/modeles/gens/runs/2024122812/gens-31-9-240.png 

The mean snow accumulation @ 240h shows the most likely outcome IMO, a dusting to a few cm at best for most lowland locations with bigger falls restricted to higher ground away from the north. 

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