Glad I’m not alone with this view 😊.

The silence from central Government is deafening. 

In terms of schools opening for example - we should be waiting for this plan to be implemented first. 

I can only repeat what I said earlier: "For me the reopening of schools is fraught with concerns and unknown risks..."

R.

 

100% agree. We need a strategy. We’re not hearing enough about this at the moment. We were running a trial on the IOW. Unless I am mistaken we’ve heard nothing since 

Frankly, I think we are going to have to solve this ourselves as there is no clear strategy from the government. We will have to do everything in our power as an individual not to spread it or catch it ourselves. We pretty much know how to do that although of course it is much easier for some than others. We all do that and wait, I guess. 

 

I don't know who is right about this but I could see some logic at the time. One person can only infect say the 5 people closest to them. It would take a different person to be already infected to infect another 5 as it is not an instant chain reaction. But of course one large gathering would be the same as a lot of small gatherings I guess, which is why it would be a bad idea as are small gatherings.

As someone else observed earlier this is not how "large gatherings" work. You are not always in a little bubble with just 5 people next to you. You go to the bar and queue with other people, you drink from glasses that other people have used that have had a quick swill, you go to the toilet and stand next to others, you interact with other onsite food and service providers, you go to packed pubs and restaurants before and after the event, you travel to these events on packed public transport...

How they could come up with this notion that mass gatherings were not important in spreading the epidemic is just farcical. 

 

Yes, she was the one who said football matches and Cheltenham were fine to go ahead

She is a moron and a nodding donkey

Whitty and Vallance are also government lackeys, too afraid to say what they really think

Jean Claude Van Dam (or whatever his name is) seems the smartest of them, but he also toes the Govt line too easily. 

I suspect they were all made to sign contracts by Cummings

Well said.

The scientists seem to have been wholly politicised. The government has ballsed this up from the beginning* and these science figures have used the daily pressers to kiss Tory arse and spin bullsh*t about how well the government is doing. 

I'm heartened by the dissolving support (per latest polls) for how this bunch of shysters is handling it, but know through bitter experience how fickle and easily-duped the plebs can be.

* I'll excuse Sunak, whose actions need to ge applauded... although if he loads the debt onto everyone - especially those who've not benefited from 2/3 months off to do sweet FA on 80% pay - then I think - would hope - there'll be severely negative reaction

 

 

Well said.

The scientists seem to have been wholly politicised. The government has ballsed this up from the beginning* and these science figures have used the daily pressers to kiss Tory arse and spin bullsh*t about how well the government is doing. 

I'm heartened by the dissolving support (per latest polls) for how this bunch of shysters is handling it, but know through bitter experience how fickle and easily-duped the plebs can be.

 

* I'll excuse Sunak, whose actions need to ge applauded... although if he loads the debt onto everyone - especially those who've not benefited from 2/3 months off to do sweet FA on 80% pay - then I think - would hope - there'll be severely negative reaction

I mentioned on the other site that as a key worker, I'd be majorly pissed off if my contributions were put up. 

I've already had a bonus in my wages for working through this. It left me in real terms with an extra £50 in my wages because of tax and NI contributions!

I mentioned on the other site that as a key worker, I'd be majorly pissed off if my contributions were put up. 

I've already had a bonus in my wages for working through this. It left me in real terms with an extra £50 in my wages because of tax and NI contributions!

The news that public sector workers - many of whom have worked through this at great personal risk - are facing a pay freeze... disgusting. 

And other essential workers like yourself having tax hikes... a disgrace. 

Meanwhile, over 1,800 private jets have flown into the UK since 'lockdown'. A similar number also flien out. Millionaires evacuated their London homes in their masses to have a fun jolly in their second homes by the sea or in the countryside (putting additional pressure on local services). Tax-dodging remains endemic amongst the wealthy. 

A financial elite have barely had their lives affected by all this.

These parasites are who we should be targeting with tax rises.

I know I sound like a broken record on this.

Ease the lockdown when we have a proper contact tracing and testing plan, with a Bluetooth app that works effectively. Not before. 

This is a relatively simple point which isn’t receiving enough  attention.  

Yup

Instead I was at work today and nearby a bunch of bloke were happily preparing a football pitch. They had not a care in the world, they were all chatting away. Virus? What Virus...

 

Either we learn to cope with the virus or we run around like headless chickens. We know who the most vulnerable groups are and in particular it is those over 75 years of age - just look at the age profile of those who died. Young families going to the beach is not going to be a problem - they are very unlikely to contract the virus out in the open on the beach in any case. As for schools - the limited opening in June should be perfectly manageable.

We cannot survive in lockdown indefinitely - so at some point it has to be relaxed.

We need to reduce the rate of infection to a point where we won’t face a catastrophic second wave.

But you only care about the lives of thousands when you can pin the blame on foreigners. 

 

The news that public sector workers - many of whom have worked through this at great personal risk - are facing a pay freeze... disgusting. 

And other essential workers like yourself having tax hikes... a disgrace. 

Meanwhile, over 1,800 private jets have flown into the UK since 'lockdown'. A similar number also flien out. Millionaires evacuated their London homes in their masses to have a fun jolly in their second homes by the sea or in the countryside (putting additional pressure on local services). Tax-dodging remains endemic amongst the wealthy. 

A financial elite have barely had their lives affected by all this.

These parasites are who we should be targeting with tax rises.

 

Spot on - tax 'em more (and rile the MMs as a bonus).

They are also the first to insist that the masses put themselves on the front line against the virus.

Aaron Banks who flew to New Zealand at the first sign of the virus telling everyone to get back to work.

---

Mark
Beckton, E London
Less than 500m from the end of London City Airport runway.

Some good points here I  and I’m sure  taxation will change its long overdue in some cases, I like the idea of a shared responsibility from young and old, hints sometime ago that things like T lock and taxation for the self employed will change 

Sunak has dropped a heavy hint that taxes on the self-employed could rise as the country comes out of crisis mode. Speaking of the lower rates of tax that are open to self-employed workers, in light of the support scheme made available to those who work for themselves, he said in March: “It is much harder to justify the inconsistent contributions of people with different employment statuses. If we all want to benefit equally from state support, we must all pay in equally.”

 

I mentioned on the other site that as a key worker, I'd be majorly pissed off if my contributions were put up. 

I've already had a bonus in my wages for working through this. It left me in real terms with an extra £50 in my wages because of tax and NI contributions!

 

The news that public sector workers - many of whom have worked through this at great personal risk - are facing a pay freeze... disgusting. 

And other essential workers like yourself having tax hikes... a disgrace.

 

That’s Toxic imo 

With members of the public gathering every Thursday night to applaud the NHS, care workers and other public sector staff at the centre of the pandemic, it would take a bold Tory chancellor to make a case for real-wage cuts and reduced funding levels.

What do you expect, the never extending lockdown means there's nothing coming in to even contemplate pay rises.
There will be years of this to follow.
A lot of the enthusiastic lockdowners think it's a way of bankrupting small business owners and that's a good thing because they probably voted tory and for brexit.
Public service employees depend on private sector or the money runs out - is that so hard to understand.

What do you expect, the never extending lockdown means there's nothing coming in to even contemplate pay rises.
There will be years of this to follow.
A lot of the enthusiastic lockdowners think it's a way of bankrupting small business owners and that's a good thing because they probably voted tory and for brexit.
Public service employees depend on private sector or the money runs out - is that so hard to understand.

Small businesses are the lifeblood of this country. There's also very, very few multi-millionaires amongst that group.

My biggest 'beef' is with corporations, who exert big influence - often through, let's face it, blackmail - over government policy; and the super-rich who abuse our pathetically lax tax laws to stash their cash offshore (to add insult to injury, in tax-haven British Overseas Territories).

As for the question of paying for the lockdown and CV19-induced deficit, we have the option of 'helicopter money'. There'd be a potential hit on asset values, but IMO that's not a bad thing.

What do you expect, the never extending lockdown means there's nothing coming in to even contemplate pay rises.
There will be years of this to follow.
A lot of the enthusiastic lockdowners think it's a way of bankrupting small business owners and that's a good thing because they probably voted tory and for brexit.
Public service employees depend on private sector or the money runs out - is that so hard to understand.

A crude, scurrilous and nonsensical accusation. Seriously, you've been reading too much claptrap on Guide, Spiked and similar.

I also think you simply don't understand why nearly every country on earth has, in one way or another, locked down. It's really surprising given we both also know stopping animal movements stops animal disease in it's tracks.

 Oh, and just remind me, you don't get any public support right? No RPA single payment paid for by tax payers?

 

My biggest 'beef' is with corporations, who exert big influence - often through, let's face it, blackmail - over government policy; and the super-rich who abuse our pathetically lax tax laws to stash their cash offshore (to add insult to injury, in tax-haven British Overseas Territories).

👍

I cringe every time I hear CEOs of these big corporations speak about looking after employees etc. The only people they're ever looking after is themselves and their major shareholders.

I know I sound like a broken record on this.

Ease the lockdown when we have a proper contact tracing and testing plan, with a Bluetooth app that works effectively. Not before. 

This is a relatively simple point which isn’t receiving enough  attention.  

Well said.

 

A crude, scurrilous and nonsensical accusation. Seriously, you've been reading too much claptrap on Guide, Spiked and similar.

I also think you simply don't understand why nearly every country on earth has, in one way or another, locked down. It's really surprising given we both also know stopping animal movements stops animal disease in it's tracks.

 Oh, and just remind me, you don't get any public support right? No RPA single payment paid for by tax payers?

 

Correct. Regrettably Four has made many such contributions to these Covid threads.

I'm baffled by the stance of Maunder and Four: the evidence from every country all points the same way and yet they conclude that the lockdown is an overreaction.

Mind you, Four spent a decade on the Climate Forum trying to pretend that climate change wasn't a threat either. 

In my opinion, the government really will be playing with fire again if they try to ease the lockdown before we have a testing and tracing system in place which Joe mentioned earlier. That is why I also agree with Joe that schools can only start to return if/when we have such a system in place.

The government have taken more than enough unneccessary gambles already which have led, directly and indirectly, to well over 30,000 deaths in this country, and that is only the official figures reported by the government each day.

Both KFC and Starbucks have begun reopening some outlets. There's massive demand - the drive-through Starbucks near me had a queue on the neighbouring car park just to join the queue through the drive-through. 

KFC's app and website are farcical and neither were letting you order online as KFC have been telling people to do. Neither Deliveroo nor Just Eat would take orders for the St Helens branch, so I ended up ordering through Deliveroo in Warrington to deliver it to the KFC car park. There were about 30 other cars had done the same, and a procession of people/cars were just turning up and hoc, but being told they were only processing online or delivery orders. The wait time was 100-130 mins.

There's a massive demand from people to just get life operating again with some normality. 

We went to Lytham St Annes today to have a big walk with the dog at somewhere different. There were hundreds of people around. Thankfully the tide was well out and we were able to let the dog have a good run without getting within 50 yards of anyone else. But the numbers were an eye-opener.