As Darren said in his last post, it looks like schools will be the focus today

On that subject and in reply to Darren.

Originally Posted by: Retron

And back to covid, there's a right old bruhaha in the papers this morning over schools. I wonder which side will win - the cautious or gung-ho side? All I know is that at my academy Trust plans are underfoot for both primaries and secondaries, but nothing concrete yet.

Oh, I've also had a flurry of emails and even a letter from Unison. I doubt they would have been impressed at my reply, which mentioned that the school has stocks of certain PPE, such as masks, visors, gloves and hand gel... everything was very much set up to nudge you along the "it's too dangerous" path...

As Darren said in his last post, it looks like schools will be the focus today

Yup, most of the papers are leading on the issue today and - as you'd expect - their view depends on the paper's political leanings.

As I mentioned in the last thread, Unison at least have been very active in drumming up support for their "it's too dangerous" stance. I'm torn on the issue - the signs are my school is taking things seriously (we have PPE, courtesy of our site team ordering in supplies), but there's no way we can get even a smidgen of normality to the school: many of our classrooms are old 50s rooms, which are tiny... no more than 9 pupils per room with proper distancing. And if that's the case, the teachers covering those classes won't be able to deal with the majority of pupils who are stuck at home.

At the moment, all teachers are expected to be online during their classes, with pupils joining via Google Classroom. Thus any questions etc can be answered pretty much instantly... but that simply can't happen if the teacher for year 8 history has been drafted in to supervise a third of a year 10 maths class, for example.

It's a logistical nightmare for us, too, as we have several hundred children a day bussed in from the Isle where I live (the island's only secondary school is atrocious, always has been, so most parents send their children to the mainland). Cramped buses are not a good way to travel at the moment!

There are some plans going on in the background, but the Trust's policy at the moment is largely based on waiting for more info from the government.

I've a feeling that the desperation in gov't to be seen to be doing something is going to lead to a messy situation, where those lucky enough to come into school will then have an advantage over their peers at home...

There's a lot of discussion about vaccine too. Operation Warp Speed in the US has the objective of making one available by the end of this year. Varous experts have cast doubts on whether it is achievable:

"I don't understand how that happens," said Dr Peter Hotez, co-director of the Medicine Coronavirus Vaccine Team at Baylor College, on CNN after Mr Trump's announcement.

"I don't see a path by which any vaccine is licensed for emergency use or otherwise till the third quarter of 2021," he added.

It makes me wonder how Gilbert in the UK can be 80% confident about having one by September this year? Time will tell.

On the subject of schools I just noticed that even in the Wild West the POTUS has said:

"I think the schools should be back in the fall," Mr Trump continued. [source BBC]

It makes me wonder why there seems to be an unseemly squabble in the UK about reopening in 2 weeks time. I presume a key driver here is that getting kids back to school allows more parents to go back to work. I can't really see any other good reasons for rushing to reopen at the start of next month, especially as most exams are cancelled and the summer hols are on the way.

Here in Western Australia we shut our borders in early March for international visitors and shortly after for other Australians from other states. The rules were so strict that even West Australians in the Eastern states were not allowed back unless under exceptional circumstances. Returning Australians were all quarantined for 14 days either in hotels in Perth or an offshore island. The results have been after 500 cases we are pretty much covid free. On Monday pubs and cafes reopen with social spacing. Some will no doubt not open due to these rules. Schools went back 2 weeks ago and attendance is compulsory. As this is Australia we will be looking at an economic reopening, which I would imagine is the case in the UK and concentrate on getting the economy pumping again. 

The consensus on the BBC this morning almost appears to be stay away from national parks etc but let’s get children back to school as, unlike in large outside parks, it is possible for effective social distancing in small indoor spaces with young children for prolonged periods of time on a daily basis.

Indeed,it makes no sense at all. Imo the govt are like rabbits caught in the headlights with no idea which way to run,its shambolic!

Schools should remain shut and if the R number creeps back above 1 by the end of the month I think they will.

 

Indeed,it makes no sense at all. Imo the govt are like rabbits caught in the headlights with no idea which way to run,its shambolic!

Schools should remain shut and if the R number creeps back above 1 by the end of the month I think they will.

Agreed it is madness.

Apparently people are not to exercise in wide open spaces because it will spread infection.

Yet we are planning confine children in classrooms and it will be OK.

Just where is "The Science" that is being followed here?

 

Agreed it is madness.

Apparently people are not to exercise in wide open spaces because it will spread infection.

Yet we are planning confine children in classrooms and it will be OK.

Just where is "The Science" that is being followed here?

It has to be the assumption that children are at a very low risk but that ignores the fact that they’re still carriers and can pass the virus to others.  It’s the point I made to Maunder last night.

Against that, what is the route back to some form of normality? If a vaccine is a year away then risks will have to be taken; the only issues are timing and monitoring/control.

It’s a bumpy road ahead.

This week, a govt minister promoted far right lies & went unpunished. The Prime Minister & the Health Secretary lied about care homes. Johnson was shown to have lied about customs checks in Northern Ireland. Teachers were maligned, lockdown chaos escalated & the R number went up.

— James O'Brien (@mrjamesob) May 16, 2020

Indeed,it makes no sense at all. Imo the govt are like rabbits caught in the headlights with no idea which way to run,its shambolic!

Schools should remain shut and if the R number creeps back above 1 by the end of the month I think they will.

I am glad I am retired from teaching and not having to address such frightful difficulties. I can't see the logic of returning kids to school now, the rump of the summer term, unless the entire focus is accelerated preparation for the autumn term so there is real purpose to the exercise, justifying any risks. I suspect it is covert child minding aims that are at the root of all this - getting folk back to work, not excellence in schooling. If we REALLY want to make an impact why not create a new term in June/July/August and take it seriously? Alternatively, what about having a really ambitious go at developing school emergency plans for the future built on the astounding efforts that have been made during CO-19 - by everyone involved in education. We should not waste this experience, but refine it "ready to roll" in any future such crisis, local or national.

I agree that there is still a strong possibility of a second peak and worse - and we need to be quicker off the mark next time with a proper lockdown and adequate home schooling from day 1. The present lackadaisical fudging of pubic health advice could well end in tears IMO.

I thought this piece in the Telegraph was in interesting take on a second peak.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/10/what-coronavirus-second-peak-wave-meaning/

Roger

We seems to be at a position where the government are saying they are following the science but decisions as time goes on seems to constantly contradict what was said before.

Take the R rate. This article suggests that the government are saying it’s less important.

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-is-the-r-rate-not-quite-as-significant-as-we-thought-11989111

On the subject of schools I just noticed that even in the Wild West the POTUS has said:

"I think the schools should be back in the fall," Mr Trump continued. [source BBC]

It makes me wonder why there seems to be an unseemly squabble in the UK about reopening in 2 weeks time. I presume a key driver here is that getting kids back to school allows more parents to go back to work. I can't really see any other good reasons for rushing to reopen at the start of next month, especially as most exams are cancelled and the summer hols are on the way.

 

 

Cummings knows that the plebs have been brainwashed to hate Unions by their newspapers, so stirring this row helps the Govt distract from their failure to protect tens of thousands of lives

 

It has to be the assumption that children are at a very low risk but that ignores the fact that they’re still carriers and can pass the virus to others.  It’s the point I made to Maunder last night.

Against that, what is the route back to some form of normality? If a vaccine is a year away then risks will have to be taken; the only issues are timing and monitoring/control.

It’s a bumpy road ahead.

I have a daughter in year 6 so she is supposed to be returning on 1st June. I've talked to other parents and the consensus is that they should go back. We're comfortable that social distancing will be possible as they are old enough to understand, however, I can't see how they can make that work for Reception and Year 1. Locally aswell we have v few cases, there are only 60 people in all the Leeds hospitals with Covid.

I look at other countries where the kids have been back for a number of weeks now e.g. Denmark and Norway. There has been no spike in cases since they returned so I do believe the risk is low - it is certainly less risky than travelling on a packed tube every day.

 

It makes me wonder how Gilbert in the UK can be 80% confident about having one by September this year? Time will tell.

I'm sure the vaccine will be ready by then but the problem is mass production and distribution and who is going to pay for it

I doubt it will be free to all, so the poor and young will probably not even bother to get it

This week, a govt minister promoted far right lies & went unpunished. The Prime Minister & the Health Secretary lied about care homes. Johnson was shown to have lied about customs checks in Northern Ireland. Teachers were maligned, lockdown chaos escalated & the R number went up.

— James O'Brien (@mrjamesob) May 16, 2020

All 100% accurate. And yet Maunder describes O'Brien as a "gobshite, worse than Owen Jones".

Hancock will go down as the worst Health Secretary this country has ever had. His record: 60,000 dead including 22,000 in care homes and yet still they defend him!

 

It has to be the assumption that children are at a very low risk but that ignores the fact that they’re still carriers and can pass the virus to others.  It’s the point I made to Maunder last night.

Against that, what is the route back to some form of normality? If a vaccine is a year away then risks will have to be taken; the only issues are timing and monitoring/control.

It’s a bumpy road ahead.

I think that's right, looking at the stats the risk to children and the vast majority of staff is tiny. However the problem is increasing the R rate and the danger posed to elderly/vulnerable relatives and staff. 

I think it's possible to open schools in some form - indeed most already are open - but I've not seen much in terms of a practical plan to do that yet.