The Weather Outlook

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Retron
21 December 2025 08:34:02

Slight exaggeration here. Maybe if you’ve spent your entire life in a Namibian Tribe, but 5 degrees is milder than a few nighttime temps we’ve had lately. 

Originally Posted by: White Meadows 

Not at all, you missed out the word "feel". I challenge you to stand by the sea, as I'll be doing, with a 40mph wind coming off it, subzero dewpoint at say 4C and say it doesn't feel perishing! It will do - and I know that from many years of experience.  It'll feel all the colder too considering the mild mush we've had of late: it's 9.9, dew 8.3 out there at the moment and that's typical of what we've had so far this month. The change will come on Monday or Tuesday as the drier Continental air kicks in...


Leysdown, north Kent
Ally Pally Snowman
21 December 2025 08:50:41
Still very decent ECM ensembles.  And interestingly more scatter around the 29th than the 1st.

https://www.wetterzentrale.de/en/show_diagrams.php?geoid=50893&model=ecm&var=2&run=0&lid=ENS&bw=1 


Bishop's Stortford 85m ASL.
DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
21 December 2025 08:50:44
FAX - LP 996mb Biscay currently pushing front across Britain from the SE but as the LP sinks S-wards to the Med (1002mb E Spain on Christmas Day) and the HP over Scandinavia intensifies (1038mb northern N Sea also Christmas Day), strong E-lies set up over England. Although these come from a long way east, there's no embedded disturbance to generate significant snowfall.

GFS Op 0Z - the HP above ridges SE-wards into Europe preventing any sustained E-lies; a cold pool brushes the S coast on Christmas Eve but after that the source of air is from SE Europe until Sun 28th. By then the HP has split and re-formed 1045mb W Scotland allowing weak N/NE-lies to creep down the E coast (further east, a deep LP running south promises heavy snowfall all the way down the Russian border). By Tue 6th the HP has moved south 1025mb E Anglia and Scotland is back into Atlantic gales.

ECM - agrees well with GFS until New Year but some retrogression of the HP implies stronger N-lies through the N Sea after New Year. On Mon 5th a weak ridge of HP 1020 mb E Scotland divides a cold east from an increasingly mild west.

AIFS - London, maxima dropping and staying at 3-5C from Wed 24th into the New Year, a little rain tonight then dry. Edinburgh, similar temp profile, rain additionally in small amounts in the week after Christmas

GEFS - dipping  for Christmas Day itself (to 5C below norm in the S, only just below in the N), after which mean stays near norm (yesterday in the S it was much below), with a big spread of ens members (mostly cooler, the mean kept up by some much milder runs). After today, best chance of rain Sun 4th.

Snow row figures now minimal with the exception of Christmas Day in the S, and New Year in the east, 10/33 on both occasions.

Still just an outside chance of a dusting of snow in the SE for Christmas, but increasingly unlikely. Cooler than we've been used to, but nothing out of the ordinary for a traditional winter.


War is God's way of teaching Americans geography - Ambrose Bierce

Chichester 12m asl

buachaille
21 December 2025 08:56:45

Not at all, you missed out the word "feel". I challenge you to stand by the sea, as I'll be doing, with a 40mph wind coming off it, subzero dewpoint at say 4C and say it doesn't feel perishing! It will do - and I know that from many years of experience.  It'll feel all the colder too considering the mild mush we've had of late: it's 9.9, dew 8.3 out there at the moment and that's typical of what we've had so far this month. The change will come on Monday or Tuesday as the drier Continental air kicks in...

Originally Posted by: Retron 

Keep going Darren. There are a few “doomcasters” and cherry pickers around, but most of us “lurkers” really appreciate your calm rational analysis. And, by my reckoning, you are likely to be standing by the sea in a windchill of around -10C, and anyone who thinks that ain’t nippy needs to experience it.

Brian Gaze
21 December 2025 09:04:06
Looks like GEFS has led us up the garden path again. I recently mentioned that several times this year the ECM ENS have won out when there has been a divergence between the models, and that appears to be the case again now. That said, there is still potential, but you really wouldn't put your house on it.

UserPostedImage


Brian Gaze

Berkhamsted

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Windy Willow
21 December 2025 09:24:47

Looks like GEFS has led us up the garden path again. I recently mentioned that several times this year the ECM ENS have won out when there has been a divergence between the models, and that appears to be the case again now. That said, there is still potential, but you really wouldn't put your house on it.

UserPostedImage

Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 

Ah well, at least it will be cold and I'll take that over mild dross at this time of the year. At least for my area it's looking like it will be very cool/cold for a good week, which probably is a change from previous years.


South Holland, Lincs 5m/16ft ASL

When I saw corruption, I was forced to find truth on my own. I couldn't swallow the hypocrisy.

Barry White

It’s the end of the world as we know it (and I feel fine) - R.E.M.

doctormog
21 December 2025 09:28:18
Nice to see Moomin backing the ECM option.

To be fair it has been hinted at for a while after the upcoming anticyclonic period.

https://www.wetterzentrale.de/maps/ECMOPEU00_282_1.png 

UserPostedImage

More generally, while still not looking overly wintry (snow over etc), the cooler than average temperatures will feel much more wintry than the mild start to the season.


moomin75
21 December 2025 09:31:21

Nice to see Moomin backing the ECM option.

To be fair it has been hinted at for a while after the upcoming anticyclonic period.

https://www.wetterzentrale.de/maps/ECMOPEU00_282_1.png 

UserPostedImage

More generally, while still not looking overly wintry (snow over etc), the cooler than average temperatures will feel much more wintry than the mild start to the season.

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

I've backed ECM throughout. It had this nailed I think.

Days on end of cool anticyclonic gloom is not pleasant!


Witney, Oxfordshire

100m ASL

Rob K
21 December 2025 09:39:11

I've backed ECM throughout. It had this nailed I think.

Days on end of cool anticyclonic gloom is not pleasant!

Originally Posted by: moomin75 

Anticyclonic gloom? Are you wintering in Iceland?


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl

"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome

doctormog
21 December 2025 09:40:25

I've backed ECM throughout. It had this nailed I think.

Days on end of cool anticyclonic gloom is not pleasant!

Originally Posted by: moomin75 

That sounds like the outlook for here, elsewhere it should be less gloomy. In fact the ECM suggests a bright or sunny day for the majority on Christmas Day (not here of course!)

 https://weather.us/model-charts/euro/united-kingdom/simulated-vis-sat-image/20251225-1500z.html

 

Edit: The GFS 00z op run also shows a similar picture in terms of sunshine for Christmas Day 


Brian Gaze
21 December 2025 09:45:08
I'm not really sure this suggests a lot of sunshine. We'll see. 

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Brian Gaze

Berkhamsted

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doctormog
21 December 2025 09:53:28

I'm not really sure this suggests a lot of sunshine. We'll see. 

UserPostedImage

Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 

I don’t think anyone is suggesting “lots of sunshine”. There will probably be quite a lot of cloud at times, but not constant unless you’re exposed to the easterly influence over a long North Sea track I.e. here.

I certainly don’t expect it to be a very sunny period, nor do I think it will be constantly grey (away from my back yard). 

I do find a 24 hour pattern change leading to self-congratulations from the usual sources a bit tedious given the time scales still involved.

(I have a mental bingo card for such developments with a couple of “numbers” still to cross off).

Given how things looked 24 hours ago, I wonder how they will look in 24 hours time. More of a trend towards a high centred over us, a shift back in the other direction, or even a growing trend towards something older from the north post Christmas? Watch this space.


Brian Gaze
21 December 2025 09:59:33

I don’t think anyone is suggesting “lots of sunshine”. There will probably be quite a lot of cloud at times, but not constant unless you’re exposed to the easterly influence over a long North Sea track I.e. here.

I certainly don’t expect it to be a very sunny period, nor do I think it will be constantly grey (away from my back yard). 

I do find a 24 hour pattern change leading to self-congratulations from the usual sources a bit tedious given the time scales still involved.

(I have a mental bingo card for such developments with a couple of “numbers” still to cross off).

Given how things looked 24 hours ago, I wonder how they will look in 24 hours time. More of a trend towards a high centred over us, a shift back in the other direction, or even a growing trend towards something older from the north post Christmas? Watch this space.

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

Agree with all of this. The only thing I would add is that as we've seen in recent decades, getting high pressure to "ping" (I think that was Darren's word) between Scandinavia and Greenland is the devil's work in the "modern" era. Therefore, my money (and obviously I don't have a crystal ball) is on the models continuing to trend towards a slowly sinking Rex block. 


Brian Gaze

Berkhamsted

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"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan

doctormog
21 December 2025 10:06:11

Agree with all of this. The only thing I would add is that as we've seen in recent decades, getting high pressure to "ping" (I think that was Darren's word) between Scandinavia and Greenland is the devil's work in the "modern" era. Therefore, my money (and obviously I don't have a crystal ball) is on the models continuing to trend towards a slowly sinking Red block. 

Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 

Precedent would suggest that scenario could be more likely but the models are still quite robust at showing higher heights in the Greenland region (or at least to the NW of the U.K.) in the medium term.

 

Christmas Day could be quite nice across much of England (albeit with a cold wind):

https://www.wetterzentrale.de/maps/GFSOPUK06_108_24.png 

https://www.wetterzentrale.de/maps/GFSOPUK06_117_53.png 


AJ*
  • AJ*
  • Advanced Member
21 December 2025 10:09:44
The ECMWF ENS 00z Precip. chart for London gives a 2% chance of snow on the 25th. After my recent interest generated by the indications for Christmas Day snow here in the far SE, I'm pretty phlegmatic about the reduction in likelihood. The 14% chance on 1st Jan suggests one eyebrow slightly raised, but the accompanying 50% chance of rain brings it down again.

https://www.theweatheroutlook.com/twodata/ecmhrens.aspx?chartname=ecmwfenspreciprate&chartlocation=london 

(My thanks to Brian for pointing out this chart a few weeks ago.) 


Angus; one of the Kent crew on TWO.

Tonbridge, 40m (131ft) asl

White Meadows
21 December 2025 10:17:30

Keep going Darren. There are a few “doomcasters” and cherry pickers around, but most of us “lurkers” really appreciate your calm rational analysis. And, by my reckoning, you are likely to be standing by the sea in a windchill of around -10C, and anyone who thinks that ain’t nippy needs to experience it.

Originally Posted by: buachaille 

There’s doomcasting, and then there’s putting things in perspective. Some of the narrative has been rather prematurely celebrated, and for those so called ‘lurkers’ or guests who may not interpret the output so well it can be very misleading. 

It will feel colder yes. ‘Perishingly’ so? I challenge the choice of adverbs more carefully. 

CField
21 December 2025 10:20:46
Ecm continue with a more northerly block theme...the northern block becomes colder and under more threat from zonality (zonal reset could be to cold zonality) as we head into January....lots of factors then come into play a colder North America again , signs of a beginnings new SSW and the new Mjo phase..I think a mid January slider scenario could possibly occur......if we can tap into enough cold air in from the East a Feb 2011 event could be on the cards


Favourite snowstorm

Famous channel low

Dec 31st 1978

Hastings East Sussex

Foot of level snow severe drifting

Next day max temp -4 degrees Celsius

BJBlake
21 December 2025 10:31:30
Now that’s a good point !! Let’s hope you are right and the whole thing comes back on by Monday. Won’t be the first time we have seen that sort of flip flop! 
Brecklands, South Norfolk 28m ASL
Quantum
21 December 2025 10:50:59
So an improvement on the 6Z.

Expect a rollercoaster ride if a cold pattern is dependent on getting a height rise across the arctic to link up to our resident midlatitude high. Its the most poorly predicted place on earth with the possible exception of the southern ocean. 


25/26 (850hpa temp) 11 days snow/sleet falling

18/11 (-4) 19/11 (-6) 20/11 (-6) 01/01 (-7) 04/01 (-10) 10/01 (-7) 11/01 (-3) 30/01 (-1) 13/02 (-6) 15/02 (-4) 18/02 (-6)

24/25 10d

18/11 (-6) 19/11 (-6) 23/11 (-2) 22/12 (-5) 04/01 (-5) 05/01 (0)14/02 (0) 15/02 (0)12/03 (-6) 13/03 (-6)

23/24 8d

29/11 (-6) 30/11 (-6) 02/12 (-5) 03/12 (-5) 04/12 (-3) 16/01 (-3) 18/01 (-8)08/02 (-5)

22/23 7d

18/12 (-1)06/03 (-6) 08/03 (-8) 09/03 (-6) 10/03 (-8) 11/03 (-5) 14/03 (-6)

21/22 12d

Hippydave
21 December 2025 10:51:41
I've seen worse D10 charts than the 6z GFS, maybe something of a reward for our NE Scotland contingent for the upcoming gloom 😋

UserPostedImage

Bigger picture I'd echo some of the less 'reactive' comments being made. It's still a blocked pattern, though one that has shifted slightly and largely keeps the colder uppers away in the reliable time frame. Where the HP wanders to was always going to be critical and continues to be so. For the speculative Xmas day snow, yes GFS, UKMO have shifted south slightly but the ECM op actually shifted north a bit and brought in slightly colder uppers as a result. It always looked a long shot getting that cold pool to hit MBY as it's a small pool and a small target but unless the 12zs remove it from the ens, it remains possible a correction further north will happen. 

As the next few GFS charts from the above one show there's still a lot of potential in the charts, whether they verify or not is TBC and I imagine the ens will continue to show various options in a still blocked regime. 


Home: Tunbridge Wells

Work: Tonbridge

Dickieboy68
21 December 2025 11:05:21
Yes, it's the ENS that may give the clue, this particular Op GFS does retrogress the high to Greenland and brings down that low shown between Iceland and Scotland all the way down to The Netherlands on 2nd Jan with 'interesting' ppt all over. 

Yes, cold still over Christmas, zero for first thing across many parts, but less snow (or any ppt) shown. And the swings and roundabouts of outrageous fortune are still to play out. Another of the 32 will be picked later and that may show more/less/different.

Currently, one foot on the ramp, one foot off, I hope the ramp doesn't move just yet....

Cheers all - happy chasing your Christmas!


Dickieboy - In the deep mid-Wiltshire 85m ASL

Formerly Guest (16) since 2004

Dickieboy68
21 December 2025 11:11:10
... And a tantalising open FI freezer door at +360... With lots of winter goodies inside....
Dickieboy - In the deep mid-Wiltshire 85m ASL

Formerly Guest (16) since 2004

Taylor1740
21 December 2025 11:22:32
Same old story with the GFS 6z, nice synoptics in FI but with a lack of properly cold uppers available, and the pattern will almost certainly get watered down nearer the time anyway.
NW Leeds - 150m amsl
Ally Pally Snowman
21 December 2025 11:27:28
Another Greenland HP on the GFS 6z. Strong theme now. 
Bishop's Stortford 85m ASL.
Gandalf The White
21 December 2025 11:33:41

Same old story with the GFS 6z, nice synoptics in FI but with a lack of properly cold uppers available, and the pattern will almost certainly get watered down nearer the time anyway.

Originally Posted by: Taylor1740 

The freezing level over the country from NYD is mostly 400 metres or lower, with 500-1,000 hPa values below 528dam and often in the low 520s until a less cold incursion moves south into Scotland at the end.


Location: South Cambridgeshire

130 metres ASL

52.0N 0.1E



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