The Weather Outlook

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johncs2016
23 January 2025 13:47:04

I loved being in the red warning area for 'The Beast' and we had a huge amount of drifting snow within hours.......however, being in tomorrow's red area fills me with dread 

Originally Posted by: Crepuscular Ray 

If there's any consolation with all of this, it looks as though the worst of the conditions will be during the day rather than at night. The winds are then expected to die down a bit by the time that we get to tomorrow night although we continue to be in a yellow warning for that on Saturday as well.

All of that still isn't great and so, I'm still expecting tomorrow night to be a wild and noisy one anyway, but it at least isn't likely to be as wild or noisy tomorrow night as it would have been if the worst of the conditions had been at night which is better than nothing I suppose.


The north of Edinburgh, usually always missing out on snow events which occur not just within the rest of Scotland or the UK, but also within the rest of Edinburgh.

DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
23 January 2025 14:01:16

If there's any consolation with all of this, it looks as though the worst of the conditions will be during the day rather than at night. The winds are then expected to die down a bit by the time that we get to tomorrow night although we continue to be in a yellow warning for that on Saturday as well.

All of that still isn't great and so, I'm still expecting tomorrow night to be a wild and noisy one anyway, but it at least isn't likely to be as wild or noisy tomorrow night as it would have been if the worst of the conditions had been at night which is better than nothing I suppose.

Originally Posted by: johncs2016 

I'm not sure that's an unmixed blessing. People are out during the day, at least if unwary or unavoidably outside, and so more at risk.

1987 - the Great Storm for SE England, overnight - 18 deaths

1990 - the Burns Day Storm for N England and Scotland, daytime - 47 deaths

Either way, it's not a good look for tomorrow - stay in shelter!


War is God's way of teaching Americans geography - Ambrose Bierce

Chichester 12m asl

Saint Snow
23 January 2025 14:32:24

If there's any consolation with all of this, it looks as though the worst of the conditions will be during the day rather than at night. [color=var(--bs-secondary-color)][font=system-ui, -apple-system, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", "Noto Sans", "Liberation Sans", Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol", "Noto Color Emoji"]johncs2016;1623837[/font][/color]

For a not inconsiderable part of the country, the strongest winds will coincide with the morning rush hour.

That's not good at all.


Martin

Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)

A TWO addict since 14/12/01

"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."

Aneurin Bevan

johncs2016
23 January 2025 14:35:06

I'm not sure that's an unmixed blessing. People are out during the day, at least if unwary or unavoidably outside, and so more at risk.

1987 - the Great Storm for SE England, overnight - 18 deaths

1990 - the Burns Day Storm for N England and Scotland, daytime - 47 deaths

Either way, it's not a good look for tomorrow - stay in shelter!

Originally Posted by: DEW 

That's exactly why I then went on to say that all of that still isn't great anyway because I do recognise that for most people, the worst time for this to be happening is during the day when a lot more people are out and about.

Our local council here in Edinburgh have put out an official statement about the impact of this event on local services but given that we're being advised to stay indoors if we can, I would expect at least some of the schools to be closed during tomorrow.

Looking at the two past events which you have mentioned, there wasn't the same official warning system in place back then which we have nowadays and the models are a lot better these days at picking up on these events than what they were back then.

That should at least help to ensure that the impacts from this aren't as great as they would otherwise have been but with an event of this magnitude, there are still likely to be impacts and so in advance, I will say that my heart goes out to anyone who is impacted by that.

EDIT:

The local council here in Edinburgh have just confirmed that all of the schools will be closed tomorrow with only essential services in operation.


The north of Edinburgh, usually always missing out on snow events which occur not just within the rest of Scotland or the UK, but also within the rest of Edinburgh.

Saint Snow
23 January 2025 14:47:29

1987 - the Great Storm for SE England, overnight - 18 deaths

1990 - the Burns Day Storm for N England and Scotland, daytime - 47 deaths

Originally Posted by: DEW 

And which gets by far the most media attention....?


Martin

Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)

A TWO addict since 14/12/01

"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."

Aneurin Bevan

scillydave
23 January 2025 14:50:32

For a not inconsiderable part of the country, the strongest winds will coincide with the morning rush hour.

That's not good at all.

Saint wrote:

No, not good at all. Mind you anyone living in the North or West of Ireland who thinks it's a good idea to go out to work or indeed for any other reason tomorrow is an idiot. Emergency services etc. excepted of course. 

Mind you it's been a long, long time since there was a storm of this magnitude so I wonder if the general public will heed the warnings.


Currently living at roughly 65m asl North of Cowbridge in the Vale of Glamorgan.

Formerly of, Birdlip, highest village in the Cotswolds and snow heaven in winter; Hawkinge in Kent - roof of the South downs and Isles of Scilly, paradise in the UK.

Lionel Hutz
23 January 2025 15:04:09

No, not good at all. Mind you anyone living in the North or West of Ireland who thinks it's a good idea to go out to work or indeed for any other reason tomorrow is an idiot. Emergency services etc. excepted of course. 

Mind you it's been a long, long time since there was a storm of this magnitude so I wonder if the general public will heed the warnings.

Originally Posted by: scillydave 

Many places in Ireland are closing tomorrow for the whole day and very few will open at the usual time. 


Lionel Hutz

Nr.Waterford , S E Ireland

68m ASL



scillydave
23 January 2025 15:08:16

Many places in Ireland are closing tomorrow for the whole day and very few will open at the usual time. 

Originally Posted by: Lionel Hutz 

That's really good to hear - I think sadly this storm may well be making the headlines for a good few days to come.


Currently living at roughly 65m asl North of Cowbridge in the Vale of Glamorgan.

Formerly of, Birdlip, highest village in the Cotswolds and snow heaven in winter; Hawkinge in Kent - roof of the South downs and Isles of Scilly, paradise in the UK.

Chunky Pea
23 January 2025 15:14:21
At the local supermarket there and bread and milk  aplenty still on the shelves. Honestly thought I'd be lucky to find anything. No one seems particularly concerned about this storm. Burned too many times I guess by overhyped forecasts. 
Patrick,

East Galway, Ireland.

Roger Parsons
23 January 2025 15:32:10

Many places in Ireland are closing tomorrow for the whole day and very few will open at the usual time. 

Originally Posted by: Lionel Hutz 

Stay safe, DrM. Hope it's not too dire.


RogerP

West Lindsey district of Lincolnshire

Everything taken together, here in Lincolnshire are more good things than man could have had the conscience to ask.

William Cobbett, in his Rural Rides - c.1830

Hungry Tiger
23 January 2025 15:38:58

Many places in Ireland are closing tomorrow for the whole day and very few will open at the usual time. 

Originally Posted by: Lionel Hutz 

Lionel. Keep us informed with regards to tomorrow assuming you don't lose your electricity.  Our thoughts are all with you guys.    🙂  Stay safe pal.    🙂 


Gavin S. FRmetS.

TWO Moderator.

Contact the TWO team - [email protected]

South Cambridgeshire. 93 metres or 302.25 feet ASL.



Saint Snow
23 January 2025 15:40:25

No, not good at all. Mind you anyone living in the North or West of Ireland who thinks it's a good idea to go out to work or indeed for any other reason tomorrow is an idiot. Emergency services etc. excepted of course. 

Mind you it's been a long, long time since there was a storm of this magnitude so I wonder if the general public will heed the warnings.

Originally Posted by: scillydave 

I was more thinking of the UK.

Thankfully from my perspective, the strongest winds are now being modelled to pass just to the NW of the major Merseyside/Manchester conurbation (a couple of days ago, Liverpool was being shown to have +90mph gusts 8-9am)

But NI, W Cumbria, SW & W Scotland are all being shown with gusts up around the 90mph mark for that time period.


Martin

Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)

A TWO addict since 14/12/01

"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."

Aneurin Bevan

scillydave
23 January 2025 15:48:01
GFS 12z  trickling out and it has the strongest winds slightly further north but unfortunately also about 10mph stronger in terms of gusts. They max out at about 118mph from what I can see.

It looks like this will be the real deal.

Ireland's strongest recorded wind speed is just 124mph back in 1978 - I'd suggest that's definitely under threat.

Edit: Arpege on the other hand dials it back a notch - 'just' 105mph as the top gust. Mind you that's likely the difference between locally destructive and widely destructive.

This storm has an unusual feeling of unreality to it - rather akin to the build up to the 40c day a few years back.


Currently living at roughly 65m asl North of Cowbridge in the Vale of Glamorgan.

Formerly of, Birdlip, highest village in the Cotswolds and snow heaven in winter; Hawkinge in Kent - roof of the South downs and Isles of Scilly, paradise in the UK.

DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
23 January 2025 15:51:13
Just personally I'm hoping it's no more than within the normal range of severe gales down here - my sister is supposed to be driving across from Bournemouth to take me out for a birthday lunch (and since you didn't ask, it's a couple of days in advance)
War is God's way of teaching Americans geography - Ambrose Bierce

Chichester 12m asl

Saint Snow
23 January 2025 16:08:43

Just personally I'm hoping it's no more than within the normal range of severe gales down here - my sister is supposed to be driving across from Bournemouth to take me out for a birthday lunch (and since you didn't ask, it's a couple of days in advance)

Originally Posted by: DEW 

Happy birthday in advance, DEW!

🎂


Martin

Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)

A TWO addict since 14/12/01

"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."

Aneurin Bevan

fairweather
23 January 2025 16:23:05

And which gets by far the most media attention....?

Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 

I know this is the usual anti S.E comment which is fair enough given the number of deaths. But I think the point being made was despite the winds being less and the population being less dense it would have been greater in the October Storm had it not been between 2.00am and 6.oo am. The 100+ mph widespread winds took out millions of trees and massive structural damage but unless their roof blew off many missed the consequences. 


S.Essex, 42m ASL
fairweather
23 January 2025 16:33:07
I wonder whether winds are responsible for more deaths in the UK than any other extreme weather like floods (1953) or Boscastle (rain).

I'm guessing it may be wind. Modern warning systems probably help - and perhaps more so with flooding because the location is more predictable. Certainly the 58 Canvey Island deaths and many of the 307 as it took time for the surge to spread down the East Coast would have been saved.


S.Essex, 42m ASL
Roger Parsons
23 January 2025 16:41:31

I wonder whether winds are responsible for more deaths in the UK than any other extreme weather like floods (1953) or Boscastle (rain).

I'm guessing it may be wind. Modern warning systems probably help - and perhaps more so with flooding because the location is more predictable. Certainly the 58 Canvey Island deaths and many of the 307 as it took time for the surge to spread down the East Coast would have been saved.

Originally Posted by: fairweather 

Lincolnshire Flooding (1953)


RogerP

West Lindsey district of Lincolnshire

Everything taken together, here in Lincolnshire are more good things than man could have had the conscience to ask.

William Cobbett, in his Rural Rides - c.1830

doctormog
23 January 2025 17:21:47
The biggest single loss of life in the U.K. in 1953 (MV Princess Victoria)was in a similar area to where the UK will get the strongest winds tomorrow.

On the subject of tomorrow, the FM is telling people not to travel but many businesses, schools etc in Scotland will be operations as normal (unless something changes) so I’m not sure how that works?


Chunky Pea
23 January 2025 17:25:18

I know this is the usual anti S.E comment which is fair enough given the number of deaths. But I think the point being made was despite the winds being less and the population being less dense it would have been greater in the October Storm had it not been between 2.00am and 6.oo am. The 100+ mph widespread winds took out millions of trees and massive structural damage but unless their roof blew off many missed the consequences. 

Originally Posted by: fairweather 

I've often heard about the Oct 1987 storm in the UK, but I'd be pretty sure the likes of Scotland and northern Wales has seen worse. I recall being stranded in Holyhead years back due to a full on storm 10 gale. The 1987 storm epicness was likely down to its rarity. We have the same issues over here by the way. Storms and big weather events that hit the more populated east coast are often over reported by the media and given more value than they really deserve statisically. 


Patrick,

East Galway, Ireland.

StoneCroze
23 January 2025 17:35:45

I've often heard about the Oct 1987 storm in the UK, but I'd be pretty sure the likes of Scotland and northern Wales has seen worse. I recall being stranded in Holyhead years back due to a full on storm 10 gale. The 1987 storm epicness was likely down to its rarity. We have the same issues over here by the way. Storms and big weather events that hit the more populated east coast are often over reported by the media and given more value than they really deserve statisically. 

Originally Posted by: Chunky Pea 

Oct. 87 storm for us, meant sustained wind speeds of 75Kts for over an hour. It was horrendous.


Alderney, Channel Islands. (previously known as Beaufort)
Chunky Pea
23 January 2025 17:56:40
GFS 12z bringing the storm in sooner with a shorter duration, but with slight increase in strength. Salthill:

UserPostedImage


Patrick,

East Galway, Ireland.

Chunky Pea
23 January 2025 17:58:15

Oct. 87 storm for us, meant sustained wind speeds of 75Kts for over an hour. It was horrendous.

Originally Posted by: StoneCroze 

That is mad! 


Patrick,

East Galway, Ireland.

DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
23 January 2025 18:03:59

I know this is the usual anti S.E comment which is fair enough given the number of deaths. But I think the point being made was despite the winds being less and the population being less dense it would have been greater in the October Storm had it not been between 2.00am and 6.oo am. The 100+ mph widespread winds took out millions of trees and massive structural damage but unless their roof blew off many missed the consequences. 

Originally Posted by: fairweather 

In relation to the number of deaths, well, more people live in London so there should be more not fewer deaths

In relation to environmental damage, the trees were still in leaf in Oct unlike the Burns Day storm

And how many people like us and the rest of our neighbourhood in mid Kent had 2 days without water and 4 days without electricity? Maybe that happened up north as well


War is God's way of teaching Americans geography - Ambrose Bierce

Chichester 12m asl

Ally Pally Snowman
23 January 2025 18:06:01

And which gets by far the most media attention....?

Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 

The Burns day storm was definitely in the South. I was in Sussex at the time significant damage.  Plenty killed in the South.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/january/25/newsid_3420000/3420797.stm&ved=2ahUKEwihws2Wt4yLAxWJQkEAHcdBB5gQFnoECBQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0bj4rzgFEJx7Lizb8KBNer 


Bishop's Stortford 85m ASL.

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