The Weather Outlook

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David M Porter
06 January 2019 11:23:21

During spring, 😜

Originally Posted by: Solar Cycles 

It lasted into the start of spring, but the Beast arrived in my area on 27th Feb, which technically was the penultimate day of the meteorogical winter. Sure, it would have been even better if it had come several weeks sooner, but not that I was complaining.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody." – Thomas Paine

tallyho_83
06 January 2019 11:24:56

06z has stepped back from northern BLOCKING:

See all the blues and purples up north and a strengthen PV and azores hp:

 

cOMPARE THAT WITH THE 00Z run at 284: - Where there is no azore HP.


Home Location - Vixen Tor Close, Okehampton, Devon (221m ASL)

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Sean Moon

Magical Moon

www.magical-moon.com

Solar Cycles
06 January 2019 11:26:59

 

It lasted into the start of spring, but the Beast arrived in my area on 27th Feb, which technically was the penultimate day of the meteorogical winter. Sure, it would have been even better if it had come several weeks sooner, but not that I was complaining.

Originally Posted by: David M Porter 

Pedantic, but indeed correct. 😁

 

tallyho_83
06 January 2019 11:35:24

00z control turns out really cold: - Potential channel low and blizzards for the south of the UK - gale force easterly! Of course not well supported and it's in FI but still something to look at and bare in mind: - With -5 to -8c uppers over most of the Uk, colder in far SE.

 


Home Location - Vixen Tor Close, Okehampton, Devon (221m ASL)

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Sean Moon

Magical Moon

www.magical-moon.com

Gooner
06 January 2019 11:39:45

During spring, 😜

Originally Posted by: Solar Cycles 

To be honest I don't give a damn when it arrives after the wait we've had , if I get 20cm and cold temps in March then good , at least Ive got it , the problem this year we had so much hope at the end of November .

For me Id rather have cold in the 2nd half of the Winter , in 2010 my Jan and Feb was rubbish and after the Nov and Dec that was such a disappointment.


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus

Banbury

North Oxfordshire

378 feet A S L



moomin75
06 January 2019 11:56:41

 

To be honest I don't give a damn when it arrives after the wait we've had , if I get 20cm and cold temps in March then good , at least Ive got it , the problem this year we had so much hope at the end of November .

For me Id rather have cold in the 2nd half of the Winter , in 2010 my Jan and Feb was rubbish and after the Nov and Dec that was such a disappointment.

Originally Posted by: Gooner 

If we have to wait until March again it better be offset with another wonderful summer as compensation.

This has to be without a doubt the most frustrating winter in a generation. At least with the zonal winters we can unequivocally write winter off early. This one is like pulling teeth. All the background signals are there but as you say Marcus, the weather will do as it pleases. I don't think the signals make a blind bit of difference in this part of the world.


Witney, Oxfordshire

100m ASL

nsrobins
06 January 2019 12:02:46

I don't think the signals make a blind bit of difference in this part of the world.

Originally Posted by: moomin75 

Not quite sure what you mean by this. The atmosphere is a contiguous and fluid volume - what happens at 180deg long. affects what happens at 0deg long. This is why the modelling of the Pacific (eg MJO) has a knock on effect on the Atlantic and so on and so forth. We can’t just look at our small neck of the woods in isolation.

 


Neil

Fareham, Hampshire 28m ASL (near estuary)

Stormchaser, Member TORRO

David M Porter
06 January 2019 12:04:43

If we have to wait until March again it better be offset with another wonderful summer as compensation.

This has to be without a doubt the most frustrating winter in a generation. At least with the zonal winters we can unequivocally write winter off early. This one is like pulling teeth. All the background signals are there but as you say Marcus, the weather will do as it pleases. I don't think the signals make a blind bit of difference in this part of the world.

Originally Posted by: moomin75 

Even with zonal winters, I don't really think that at the start of December, anyone can say with unadulterated 100% certainty that there will definitely be no spell of meaningful cold before the season's end. Three weeks is a long time when it comes to forecasting the British weather, never mind three months.

Look at winter 2004/05 for example. The early-middle part of that winter was no better for coldies generally than this one thus far has been save for the fact that some areas had a White Xmas in 2004. Later in January and early Feb 2005 though the zonality began to ease and there were suggestions of a cold spell of sorts to end that winter. I can recall the famous occasion in Feb 2005 when the models, having for a while suggested a cold outbreak, then seemed to renage on it and one esteemed member here declared that winter was over. How wrong the member concerned turned out to be!


Lenzie, Glasgow

"A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody." – Thomas Paine

Solar Cycles
06 January 2019 12:08:27

 

Not quite sure what you mean by this. The atmosphere is a contiguous and fluid volume - what happens at 180deg long. affects what happens at 0deg long. This is why the modelling of the Pacific (eg MJO) has a knock on effect on the Atlantic and so on and so forth. We can’t just look at our small neck of the woods in isolation.

 

Originally Posted by: nsrobins 

Indeed, however I still think we’ll never fully understand these fluid dynamics with so many of them having to fall into line in order for Blighty to reap the rewards. Now if only someone could turn the Atlantic Conveyor switch off we’d be in business.😎

Solar Cycles
06 January 2019 12:09:46

 

To be honest I don't give a damn when it arrives after the wait we've had , if I get 20cm and cold temps in March then good , at least Ive got it , the problem this year we had so much hope at the end of November .

For me Id rather have cold in the 2nd half of the Winter , in 2010 my Jan and Feb was rubbish and after the Nov and Dec that was such a disappointment.

Originally Posted by: Gooner 

I’d rather have my cold fix during the first half of winter, late Feb and early March snows never stay around long enough to enjoy.

Brian Gaze
06 January 2019 12:10:57

I think the current jelly high spell of weather is a case in point. Here it delivered several rather cold days, with the lowest max of 3.3C on Friday 4th, but only one frost. There was speculation in the MO thread about an inversion leading to the ice days and widespread frosts. It hasn't happened. As I pointed out spells of weather like that are as rare as genuine upper level cold outbreaks from the north or east. I think Maunder flagged up an example that occurred between 10 or 15 ago and from recollection he was right.  


Brian Gaze

Berkhamsted

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Robertski
06 January 2019 12:26:09
I'm afraid guys that this time round Many parts of northern Greece got our snow, my family near Thessaloniki received about 30cm of snow over the 4th and 5th of January!!

We still have plenty of winter left and the models still toy with us. I'm sure at some point we will have fall of snow in parts of the UK and frosts.

However the long range forecasts have proven to be JFF!!😁πŸ˜₯

Karl Guille
06 January 2019 12:29:41

Disappointing output as the 'promise' of something much colder once again slips away to our east with high pressure holding on over the UK instead of repositioning more to our north east.  Still plenty of 'jam tomorrow' on show but as we know that's generally where most of them stay!! The ECM chart I posted the other day had two to three cold days here in the Channel Islands from a half decent easterly with 850s circa -4 to -6 or 7 with the promise of more to come and now we have nothing and little sign of anything really cold on the horizon. It would be nice to see a short-term upgrade in the models for once rather than the standard down grades!


St. Sampson

Guernsey

Whether Idle
06 January 2019 12:37:47
The GEFS 6z control run shows the pathway to a mild January. Should that be pursued, the first half of winter CET from Dec 1 - Jan 21 would be pushing 6.5c +. However, what I expect is that there will be more Pm incursions as per the Op, and this will result in cooler interludes balancing mider ones, with a first half of winter CET at 6c or below.
Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
tallyho_83
06 January 2019 12:44:38

I'm afraid guys that this time round Many parts of northern Greece got our snow, my family near Thessaloniki received about 30cm of snow over the 4th and 5th of January!!
We still have plenty of winter left and the models still toy with us. I'm sure at some point we will have fall of snow in parts of the UK and frosts.
However the long range forecasts have proven to be JFF!!😁πŸ˜₯

Originally Posted by: Robertski 

 

Indeed! I remember this chart I copied and saved in early Jan 2017 - Looks like a deja vu sadly but in Jan 2019:

 

Yet the Irony is that NW Europe is meant to be the coldest spot or at least cooler according to many LR Model forecasts with the south east meant to be the mildest - so many LRF seem wrong esp the CFSv2 monthly which was due to come out 2 to 4c above average for many parts of south east Europe with north west Europe being average in terms of temps. I guess the only hope is that Jan is only 6 days old and if we want to start seeing something colder and more blocked we really do need to crank this up and bit and soon!!!

Meanwhile it;s still anticyclonic boring gloom!


Home Location - Vixen Tor Close, Okehampton, Devon (221m ASL)

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Sean Moon

Magical Moon

www.magical-moon.com

moomin75
06 January 2019 12:49:08

 

 

Indeed! I remember this chart I copied and saved in early Jan 2017 - Looks like a deja vu sadly but in Jan 2019:

 

Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 

This is one thing that's always bugged me. Is it any surprise that Greece gets colder than us in winter. We are on the edge of a warm vast expanse of water, Greece is on the edge of a very cold vast expanse of continental land mass. Any northerly incursion there is ALWAYS going to be cold in winter as they don't have a huge swathe of very warm (comparatively speaking) water to temper their weather. We will almost always be mild as the Atlantic is our warm but wet blanket.


Witney, Oxfordshire

100m ASL

tallyho_83
06 January 2019 13:00:04

This is one thing that's always bugged me. Is it any surprise that Greece gets colder than us in winter. We are on the edge of a warm vast expanse of water, Greece is on the edge of a very cold vast expanse of continental land mass. Any northerly incursion there is ALWAYS going to be cold in winter as they don't have a huge swathe of very warm (comparatively speaking) water to temper their weather. We will almost always be mild as the Atlantic is our warm but wet blanket.

Originally Posted by: moomin75 

2 years ago to the very day: - We see a similar pattern!  

6th Jan 2017

 

NOW FOR 6th Jan 2019:

 


Home Location - Vixen Tor Close, Okehampton, Devon (221m ASL)

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Sean Moon

Magical Moon

www.magical-moon.com

Shropshire
06 January 2019 13:16:23

 

 

Indeed! I remember this chart I copied and saved in early Jan 2017 - Looks like a deja vu sadly but in Jan 2019:

 

Yet the Irony is that NW Europe is meant to be the coldest spot or at least cooler according to many LR Model forecasts with the south east meant to be the mildest - so many LRF seem wrong esp the CFSv2 monthly which was due to come out 2 to 4c above average for many parts of south east Europe with north west Europe being average in terms of temps. I guess the only hope is that Jan is only 6 days old and if we want to start seeing something colder and more blocked we really do need to crank this up and bit and soon!!!

Meanwhile it;s still anticyclonic boring gloom!

Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 

That chart has happened multiple times over the last 20 years. The reverse only a handful of times.


From December 27th 2020, zonality will be banned from mixing with the UK. We appreciate that this may come as a shock to younger people and old Uncle Barty. This ban will last for a minimum of ten days.
doctormog
06 January 2019 13:18:39
It's known as a continental climate. The far SE of Europe has a much warmer summer and much colder winter than the far NW thanks to the maritime influence and our prevailing westerly climate. If we got the world to spin the other direction we'd be sorted!
JACKO4EVER
06 January 2019 13:20:55
Well with signs of the jet moving south after next weekend we could start to see a spell of more Atlantic driven weather. Perhaps ok for northern high ground wintryness, otherwise I think sadly the output in the longer term is now of the jam tomorrow variety. This winter could well go down as the one that promised most but delivered least. Let’s see, there is still some ENS interest but with each passing day this never approaches into the reliable timeframe. It’s not a moan, just an observation that is plain for all to see.
doctormog
06 January 2019 13:37:29
Don't tell me that the change to colder more unsettled conditions has been pushed back from mid-January to mid-January...again. Next we know it the anticyclonic conditions won't be moving in until the 14th to the 17th of the month.
Hungry Tiger
06 January 2019 14:14:28

 

 

Indeed! I remember this chart I copied and saved in early Jan 2017 - Looks like a deja vu sadly but in Jan 2019:

 

Yet the Irony is that NW Europe is meant to be the coldest spot or at least cooler according to many LR Model forecasts with the south east meant to be the mildest - so many LRF seem wrong esp the CFSv2 monthly which was due to come out 2 to 4c above average for many parts of south east Europe with north west Europe being average in terms of temps. I guess the only hope is that Jan is only 6 days old and if we want to start seeing something colder and more blocked we really do need to crank this up and bit and soon!!!

Meanwhile it;s still anticyclonic boring gloom!

Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 

There is some colossal snowfalls taking place in Italy and Austria atm. Some where in Austria last night there was a 3metre fall.

 


Gavin S. FRmetS.

TWO Moderator.

Contact the TWO team - [email protected]

South Cambridgeshire. 93 metres or 302.25 feet ASL.



Shropshire
06 January 2019 14:15:38

It's known as a continental climate. The far SE of Europe has a much warmer summer and much colder winter than the far NW thanks to the maritime influence and our prevailing westerly climate. If we got the world to spin the other direction we'd be sorted!

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

No, friends who live in Greece say they locals say there been snow where they live in the last 20 years than they remember in their lifetimes.

We know why - inability to build HLB.

 


From December 27th 2020, zonality will be banned from mixing with the UK. We appreciate that this may come as a shock to younger people and old Uncle Barty. This ban will last for a minimum of ten days.
Whether Idle
06 January 2019 14:15:55

It's known as a continental climate. The far SE of Europe has a much warmer summer and much colder winter than the far NW thanks to the maritime influence and our prevailing westerly climate. If we got the world to spin the other direction we'd be sorted!

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

πŸ˜…. Nicely put. It never ceases to make me chuckle how people think the UK has a colder mid winter climate than most of Greece. It does not!

As you put it, it’s called a continental climate. Ours is maritime. Greece is far better placed to receive cold shots from the NE. It is far more “unfair” if we get the cold rather than Greece, and it is far less likely here, being an island on the western edge of the colossal Atlantic, with its North Atlantic Drift and jet aloft.

 


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Gandalf The White
06 January 2019 14:29:44

Indeed, however I still think we’ll never fully understand these fluid dynamics with so many of them having to fall into line in order for Blighty to reap the rewards. Now if only someone could turn the Atlantic Conveyor switch off we’d be in business.😎

Originally Posted by: Solar Cycles 

That wouldn't alter the predominant west-east flow: you'd just get colder rain....


Location: South Cambridgeshire

130 metres ASL

52.0N 0.1E



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