Yes, I'm afraid I've also done that - I chat to the neighbours from a safe distance and of   course everyone comes out for a clap on Thursdays, which inevitably ends in little groups standing around at a safe distance having a "chin-wag". 

Personally, I don't see the problem as long as everyone abides by the 2M rule.

I absolutely agree.  Yes, I’ve had a safe distance chat with the neighbours and make no apologies.  It really is down to using common sense and staying safe.  We have to have rules for those who don’t understand the basics and can’t apply common sense.  I’m absolutely sure the rules were set to allow a little leeway for a cheeky cheat at a safe level.  Otherwise we’d have been put under house arrest and we’d all go mad!  

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I agree entirely. If anything can perhaps define "staying alert" then maybe this is it. By defining situations to closely they have caused confusion when really it's all "bleedin' obvious" if you apply some thoughtful logic.

  Quite!  I suppose they could hardly stick with the ‘stay at home’ slogan now we’re allowed out more!  

Although I think they did need to define things because some can’t apply logic and don’t see the bleedin’ obvious sadly! 

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I asked this earlier but don't think anyone had any thoughts:

Regarding the latest exercise guidance in England, can anyone explain....
If a household group are allowed out to exercise together or sit in the park etc, but have to keep 2 metres away from any other groups of people, how is that different from meeting more than one other person from another household, as you still have to keep 2 metres away from them?

Answers on a postcard please.

There isn't. The Government have just cocked up the wording on a lot of it. There is logic but the Government did its best to hide it. Should have kept it simple, which in actual fact it is.

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Looks like shopping centres are going to re-open on Monday.

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/maidstone/news/all-poundland-stores-set-to-reopen-227131/

As ever, I won't be going to them!

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The rules are, you can meet one other person from another household.  That’s you as a single person, not your household, so there are only two people.  Never more than two, unless you are all from the same household.  I suspect this helps young people to meet their best mate and helps those living alone to feel less isolated.   

It’s about stopping large groups gathering and having to draw the line somewhere, so the rest is down to common sense!  If hubby and I go out for a walk and happen to meet another couple we know, we’d stand and have a chat.  We’ll probably all bend the rules slightly but better bent than broken completely.  

But my point is, household groups are allowed to go to the park, provided they stay more than 2 metres apart. So what is to stop one family group sitting down and anther family group sitting 2 metres away from them? That would be allowed if they are not "socialising" but just happen to be there, but suddenly if they know each other they are breaking the rules, even if they stay 2 metres apart?

 

On the bank holiday Friday, like many people we had a distanced street party, where people sat in their front gardens or at the end of their driveways. We were close enough to chat to the neighbours even though we stayed on our own property or the pavement outside. As far as I know that wasn't breaking the rules, or was it if we happened to be on the pavement while talking to the neighbours, rather than on the driveway?

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If positive tests translates into the same as new cases, that's the lowest figure since March 31st.

I think it does? It is a lower figure, encouragingly.

Way short of the testing target again though 

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Breakdown of the 244 hospital deaths in England by date

• 40 on May 12th


• 72 on May 11th


• 27 on May 10th


• 62 between May 1st and May 9th


• 42 in April


• 1 on March 27th

Looks like shopping centres are going to re-open on Monday.

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/maidstone/news/all-poundland-stores-set-to-reopen-227131/

As ever, I won't be going to them!

The experts must think we've got corona virus under lock and key. Personally I'm amazed but obviously they are much better placed and have access to all of the data and models. 

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Completed my self employed income support application this afternoon - quick and easy and getting more of less what I expected. Should be in my account in a few days. I can drink again 

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The experts must think we've got corona virus under lock and key. Personally I'm amazed but obviously they are much better placed and have access to all of the data and models. 

Obviously most shops in shopping centres will remain closed.   

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But my point is, household groups are allowed to go to the park, provided they stay more than 2 metres apart. So what is to stop one family group sitting down and anther family group sitting 2 metres away from them? That would be allowed if they are not "socialising" but just happen to be there, but suddenly if they know each other they are breaking the rules, even if they stay 2 metres apart?

On the bank holiday Friday, like many people we had a distanced street party, where people sat in their front gardens or at the end of their driveways. We were close enough to chat to the neighbours even though we stayed on our own property or the pavement outside. As far as I know that wasn't breaking the rules, or was it if we happened to be on the pavement while talking to the neighbours, rather than on the driveway?

It is no different Rob.  You’re absolutely right.  There’s nothing to stop another family group sitting two metres away from your family group and your street party sounds like every other street party around the country.   As I said, if hubby and I meet another couple when walking, we chat.

It’s about being alert to what’s safe.  The wording could have been better but it means exactly the same.  I suppose we could challenge whether we broke the rules on a technicality but it would be petty and most people can use common sense.  Others need spoon feeding though and I think the rules have to be a little tighter than they need to be to allow for those. 

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It is no different Rob.  You’re absolutely right.  There’s nothing to stop another family group sitting two metres away from your family group and your street party sounds like every other street party around the country.   As I said, if hubby and I meet another couple when walking, we chat.

It’s about being alert to what’s safe.  The wording could have been better but it means exactly the same.  I suppose we could challenge whether we broke the rules on a technicality but it would be petty and most people can use common sense.  Others need spoon feeding though and I think the rules have to be a little tighter than they need to be to allow for those. 

Exactly Caz, some people need to just work this out what it really means. It's about being as safe as we can in the circumstances. After this period with the 2m measure, its sort of engrained now wherever or whatever place you find yourself in. That 2m has become your space. Enter it and it feels uncomfortable, it feels wrong. For those where it doesn't either means they haven't been out, or been applying it!

Just waiting for the new advice to come out now which says it should be 3m, then we'll all be buggered!

Completed my self employed income support application this afternoon - quick and easy and getting more of less what I expected. Should be in my account in a few days. I can drink again 

Nice to know my tax isn't being wasted 

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Exactly Caz, some people need to just work this out what it really means. It's about being as safe as we can in the circumstances. After this period with the 2m measure, its sort of engrained now wherever or whatever place you find yourself in. That 2m has become your space. Enter it and it feels uncomfortable, it feels wrong. For those where it doesn't either means they haven't been out, or applying.

Just waiting for the new advice to come out now which says it should be 3m, then we'll all be buggered!

In Germany it’s 1.5m 🤷‍♂️

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Knowing how dodgy a large number of self employed traders are around here I hope these Government help schemes are extremely tightly monitored and hopefully even more strictly than the Universal Credit scheme. With their skill at avoiding tax and manipulating the system I would hate to think that some are working and claiming. Certainly the local builders/traders round here are still all working.

It is us tax payers who are and will be paying for these schemes, probably for years to come - it's not some generosity from the Government.

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Exactly Caz, some people need to just work this out what it really means. It's about being as safe as we can in the circumstances. After this period with the 2m measure, its sort of engrained now wherever or whatever place you find yourself in. That 2m has become your space. Enter it and it feels uncomfortable, it feels wrong. For those where it doesn't either means they haven't been out, or been applying it!

Just waiting for the new advice to come out now which says it should be 3m, then we'll all be buggered!

Oh now that would bugger it up!  

I think your post emphasises the most important thing.  Two metres!  That is the only thing that really matters, plus being out in the open. 

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Knowing how dodgy a large number of self employed traders are around here I hope these Government help schemes are extremely tightly monitored and hopefully even more strictly than the Universal Credit scheme. With their skill at avoiding tax and manipulating the system I would hate to think that some are working and claiming. Certainly the local builders/traders round here are still all working.

It is us tax payers who are and will be paying for these schemes, probably for years to come - it's not some generosity from the Government.

You can only claim from the self employed traders scheme if you've submitted your self assessment tax return by I believe 25th April.

Andy isn't getting a freebie anymore than furloughed employees are having 80% of their wages paid by the govt.

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Knowing how dodgy a large number of self employed traders are around here I hope these Government help schemes are extremely tightly monitored and hopefully even more strictly than the Universal Credit scheme. With their skill at avoiding tax and manipulating the system I would hate to think that some are working and claiming. Certainly the local builders/traders round here are still all working.

It is us tax payers who are and will be paying for these schemes, probably for years to come - it's not some generosity from the Government.

If I understand this correctly, the support for self employed relates to how much tax they paid the previous year, therefore how much of their earnings they’ve declared.  Those who are working on the side and claiming, won’t be declaring their earnings, so they’ll be stuffed if we get another outbreak next year!  

Edit - And what Llamy said.  ^^^

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Knowing how dodgy a large number of self employed traders are around here I hope these Government help schemes are extremely tightly monitored and hopefully even more strictly than the Universal Credit scheme. With their skill at avoiding tax and manipulating the system I would hate to think that some are working and claiming. Certainly the local builders/traders round here are still all working.

It is us tax payers who are and will be paying for these schemes, probably for years to come - it's not some generosity from the Government.

Yes that's my sceptical feeling as well some are getting double bubble and don't mind this going on for as long as possible. Never seen so many trade vans going past our place. I also suspect when there were a lot less cars on the road, some drug dealers switched to these type of vans so they are not as easily spotted.

You can only claim from the self employed traders scheme if you've submitted your self assessment tax return by I believe 25th April.

Andy isn't getting a freebie anymore than furloughed employees are having 80% of their wages paid by the govt.

Also as it's based on what you declare if you have done lots of cash in hand work etc. you'll only get paid for the limited amount you've declared through your books. I know someone who got caught by that, which I wasn't particularly sympathetic about.

 

EDIT - I see others made the same point before me!

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