The Weather Outlook

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Solar Cycles
25 December 2016 12:06:28

 

I hope it's the former - 1988 was a total mild fest I seem to remember - 87 had the January and March cold spells with both being very notable.

Originally Posted by: Scandy 1050 MB 

Indeed but he's covered all bases now. 😂😂😂

Gandalf The White
25 December 2016 12:07:31

In the TWO winter forecast I dropped subtle hints that this winter could have similarities with 198 (7 or 8 I can never remember which one it was). Let's wait and see if that turns out to be the case. 

Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 

It was 1987; I remember it well having had two episodes of frozen pipes and water coming through the ceiling.

Happy Christmas.


Location: South Cambridgeshire

130 metres ASL

52.0N 0.1E



Brian Gaze
25 December 2016 12:09:33

Indeed but he's covered all bases now. 😂😂😂

Originally Posted by: Solar Cycles 

Yes, it was a poor attempt at humour on my part. 

Happy Christmas to all. 


Brian Gaze

Berkhamsted

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Chichesterweatherfan2
25 December 2016 12:41:05
Actually very funny...as I remember both winters well and quite a contrast they were! happy Christmas one and All!
Stormchaser
25 December 2016 12:44:04

Happy Christmas/Holidays everyone :)

We may just about get enough upstream amplification from the recent spike in MJO activity to allow us to make something interesting of the mid-Atlantic ridge later next week.

The more poleward the ridge can be the better, as this helps disrupt the vortex and is our only decent defence against the more organised stratospheric vortex - though even it shows signs of easing up and displacing toward Europe.

Many recent winters we've seen a vortex displacement toward the US result in deep cold digging way south, yet during a displacement toward us the thermal contrast with the N Atlantic often just makes it stormy instead... we need either an exceptional displacement right down to C Europe or a split vortex with exensive HLB. Both look a bit of a long shot from our current standpoint but I never like to say never!


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nsrobins
25 December 2016 13:31:08
Data issues or not, the change was being modelled before some of the trans Atlantic pilots took their Christmas break so I'm not that bothered with the data debate this time round 😉
Neil

Fareham, Hampshire 28m ASL (near estuary)

Stormchaser, Member TORRO

GlenH
25 December 2016 13:39:20

I'll take that for the end of the high resolution part of the run:

 

Joe Bloggs
25 December 2016 14:56:06

Data issues or not, the change was being modelled before some of the trans Atlantic pilots took their Christmas break so I'm not that bothered with the data debate this time round 😉

Originally Posted by: nsrobins 

An important point! :-) 

JACKO4EVER
25 December 2016 15:32:24
Data issues are not a myth, I thought Brian and Darren finally nailed this last year?

Interesting though to see some easterly influenced charts now entering the high res. If this is still the case come Wednesday then I would say things are definitely worth looking seriously at

The Beast from the East
25 December 2016 16:27:07

http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2016122512/gfs-0-168.png?12

looks like a quick toppler so far

 


Purley, Surrey, 70m ASL

"We have some alternative facts for you"

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The Beast from the East
25 December 2016 16:30:10

poor run for coldies

http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2016122512/gfs-0-186.png?12

 


Purley, Surrey, 70m ASL

"We have some alternative facts for you"

Kelly-Ann Conway - former special adviser to the President

Gusty
25 December 2016 16:40:14

The 6z and 12z GFS have both looked odd with regard to the advection and displacement of cold air into the UK in such a relatively short space of time. CAA from the north followed by WAA from the south are both at play courtesy of a High pressure in the atlantic and then over southern Europe in a space of just 12 hours.

I'm thinking there is a data issue here. 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent

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Weathermac
25 December 2016 16:41:11
Ukmo is loaded with potential nice ridging into the atlantic and linking with the arctic high.
Gusty
25 December 2016 16:51:52

The data issues appears to have resolved itself now. 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent

Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue

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Join Kent Weather on Facebook.

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RobN
  • RobN
  • Advanced Member
25 December 2016 18:18:42

Not just a butterfly at work here, more like a whole flock of pterodactyls..

Nice WAA...

And  rampant southerly tracking jet...

 

Back down to earth with a bump within a day or two perhaps


Rob

In the flatlands of South Cambridgeshire 15m ASL.

Gooner
25 December 2016 18:40:49

So every time there is a lack of data, the models lob a load of blocking in ...............just for good measure and to wind us up

 

Come off it


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus

Banbury

North Oxfordshire

378 feet A S L



Chunky Pea
25 December 2016 18:48:16

To be honest, I don't think a relative lack of data is going to make much difference in FI land - not that the naked eye will notice anyway. It isn't as if FI charts become more reliable with a full data set or anything.


Patrick,

East Galway, Ireland.

JACKO4EVER
25 December 2016 18:56:53

So every time there is a lack of data, the models lob a load of blocking in ...............just for good measure and to wind us up

 

Come off it

Originally Posted by: Gooner 

Marcus not at all,I'm sure there have been a few Christmas periods in the past where the output was a zonal train, and even with lack of data it still remained zonal.  There is some lack of data at Christmas, that's a fact. 

In the meantime some frost and fog next week for parts of England and Wales, Scotland milder in a SW flow. 

Arcus
25 December 2016 18:58:47
ECM total number of obs going into a run is typically over 3 million. Aircraft obs typically around 160,000 dependant on collation time

ECM aircraft obs collated for:

12z 24/12/2016 - 131,846

18z 24/12 - 188,250

00z 25/12 - 152,127

06z 25/12 - 65,712

12z 25/12 - 85,310


Ben,

Nr. Easingwold, North Yorkshire

30m asl

White Meadows
25 December 2016 19:09:50

ECM total number of obs going into a run is typically over 3 million. Aircraft obs typically around 160,000 dependant on collation time

ECM aircraft obs collated for:
12z 24/12/2016 - 131,846
18z 24/12 - 188,250
00z 25/12 - 152,127
06z 25/12 - 65,712
12z 25/12 - 85,310

Originally Posted by: Arcus 

so 5% (or far less) possible chance of disruption due to amended flight schedules. 

You have to laugh really.... the most amusing part is those using it in their favour for a mild/ cold ramp

Arcus
25 December 2016 19:12:01

 

so 5% possible chance of disruption due to amended flight schedules. 

You have to laugh really.... the most amusing part is those using it in their favour for a mild/ cold ramp

Originally Posted by: White Meadows 

Well I wouldn't like to attribute any weighting on those obs! Anyway forgot to link that data coverage:

http://www.ecmwf.int/en/forecasts/charts/monitoring/dcover?time=2016122512,0,2016122512&obs=aircraft

 

 


Ben,

Nr. Easingwold, North Yorkshire

30m asl

LA2B MeridFlowEuro09
25 December 2016 19:37:50

There is a Toppling over the NW Atlantic being clearly evident around 1-2 January, the Newfoundland Low should knock over Saturday's retrogression N Atlantic High, that will push the brief Cold Northerly flow proved for New Year's Day Sunday as pressure from N Atlantic builds over the UK on 2-3 January et all.

GFS and UKMO and ECMWF show that Polar S Tracking Iceland Low hitting us for about 48hrs circa 1-2 Jan.... The Low over NW will export some mild air into the SE tracking N Atlantic briefly Retrogressed UK High as after it moves there from UK Sat. 31 December, the NE USA NF Lows tends to send the Main ColdCore of Arctic plunge over NE and N Europe NE ofUK instead at 144-168hrs et all.

We can still live in wishful hopecasting though.☀️🌥🌞❄️😂😆😎.


Climate is warming up, Scotland and N Ireland and North England still often gets some Winter frost, ice and snow, November to March, but the SE and South UK including S Central England and Wales, together with the West and North through the year, they sometimes get more rain than London and S SE England, where some longer dry fine spells without much heavy rain is seen every year.

The North Atlantic Sea often gets some much Colder Wintry conditions from November to March Months, and Mild SW and South winds tend to be more frequent over the East and SE of North Atlantic Sea, as the Azores High tends to stay in charge. 

With this warmth and heat, the Central and South UK has become mostly free of snow and frost.

Retron
25 December 2016 19:39:14

 

so 5% (or far less) possible chance of disruption due to amended flight schedules. 

You have to laugh really.... the most amusing part is those using it in their favour for a mild/ cold ramp

Originally Posted by: White Meadows 

Laugh all you like, it really does make a difference. The majority of obs input into ECM are satellite-based surface data and not the upper air info which comes from planes. Although the number of plane obs is low in the grand scheme of things, they provide data we can't get any other way.

Losing half of that data input, as we do over Christmas, has a bigger effect than the overall percentage would suggest.

 

 


Leysdown, north Kent
JACKO4EVER
25 December 2016 19:46:36

 

Laugh all you like, it really does make a difference. The majority of obs input into ECM are satellite-based surface data and not the upper air info which comes from planes. Although the number of plane obs is low in the grand scheme of things, they provide data we can't get any other way.

Losing half of that data input, as we do over Christmas, has a bigger effect than the overall percentage would suggest.

 

 

Originally Posted by: Retron 

exactly, well said. no substitute for the ignorance of some I suppose.

Chunky Pea
25 December 2016 20:26:05

I sincerely hope that this set up shown on the last frame of the ECM tonight is due to the 'missing data' issue

 

 

 


Patrick,

East Galway, Ireland.

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