It feels like you’re trying to reopen the arguments in the old Climate Forum; it’s not going to end well since you appear not to have shifted your opinions at all despite the evidence.
Science doesn’t work as your last sentence suggests; but then you also know that.
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Why don't you answer my earlier post responding to yours? To be clear I have highlighted the parts I agree with.
Here is my post again - we can move on after I get your response The key bit is at the end - this...
It appears that you consider these factors insignificant in the global warming scenario? Is that right?
Do you or don't you?
Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White Well, firstly, you said, “the Arctic Ice science that plays such a significant role in the global warming scenario.” That isn’t correct: the predictions, which have proved accurate, were that the Arctic would warm faster. But that doesn’t mean it plays a significant role; you’ve got the cart ahead of the horse here. The warming in the Arctic is a consequence of climate change; it doesn’t ‘play a significant role’.
As for your focus on a single year’s apparent anomalous growth, we’re only part of the way into the growth cycle and it is just one year. There has always been natural variation..........................
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I agree, but there are other considerations.
One difference revolves around the meaning of 'significance' and the relative importance of positive feedbacks.
This is from Wiki.....
Ice–albedo feedback is a positive feedback climate process where a change in the area of ice caps, glaciers, and sea ice alters the albedo and surface temperature of a planet. Ice is very reflective, therefore some of the solar energy is reflected back to space. Ice–albedo feedback plays an important role in global climate change.[1] For instance, at higher latitudes, warmer temperatures melt the ice sheets.[2] However, if warm temperatures decrease the ice cover and the area is replaced by water or land, the albedo would decrease. This increases the amount of solar energy absorbed, leading to more warming.[3] The effect has mostly been discussed in terms of the recent trend of declining Arctic sea ice.[4] The change in albedo acts to reinforce the initial alteration in ice area leading to more warming. Warming tends to decrease ice cover and hence decrease the albedo, increasing the amount of solar energy absorbed and leading to more warming. In the geologically recent past, the ice–albedo positive feedback has played a major role in the advances and retreats of the Pleistocene (~2.6 Ma to ~10 ka ago) ice sheets.[5] Inversely, cooler temperatures increase ice, which increases albedo, leading to more cooling.
etc...
Additionally, reduced ice extent, leads to reduced snow cover in the temperate lands - which we have all noticed and is obvious to any reasonable observer . This adds to the positive feedback.
So........ how do you differentiate between the words 'importance' and 'significance'? 'Importance' to me suggests 'significant'?
Another positive feedback relating to ice extent, I think, is the connection with water vapour, Less ice, more open and warmer waters, lead to increased water vapour and less heat loss through radiation and higher temperatures. Do you think that plays an important part?
Over and above the direct CO2 causes of global warming, Arctic Ice loss feedbacksl lead to less snow cover and melting permafrost in temperate lands and this releases methane, which as you know is a much more powerful greenhouse gas than CO2. How important is this in Global warming?
It appears that you consider these factors insignificant in the global warming scenario? Is that right?
Edited by user
31 October 2021 12:27:41
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Reason: Not specified
"The professional standards of science must impose a framework of discipline and at the same time encourage rebellion against it". – Michael Polyani (1962)
"If climate science is sound and accurate, then it should be able to respond effectively to all the points raised…." - Grandad
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts". - Bertrand Russell
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
"A consensus means that everyone agrees to say collectively what no one believes individually.”- Abba Eban, Israeli diplomat
Dave,Derby