Essan
17 May 2020 19:46:39

Originally Posted by: Devonian 


Right! 50K death are unacceptable (let alone several 100k)  so is people being bankrupted - nor can the govt pay us all for ever.


But, I can manage on little (yes, I'm lucky to be able to) and the quiet, the cleanness of the air, the ability to see the natural world breath - it's truly wondrous. How millions can't see that to just point to how disconnected we are and how huge the problem is.





I do hope that some people at least will learn from this; discover the difference between want and need, and that actually, what they really need isn't all about money and material possession.  And that they already have more than they need, if only they look.    We'll see.

I'd love to think the environmental benefits will persist too, but am less confidence about that.   More cars about today then I have seen in 2 months .....


Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
NickR
17 May 2020 19:47:19
For anyone underplaying the serious health impacts covid-19 looks like it could have on a LOT of people, I suggest reading this thread.

https://twitter.com/felicitycallard/status/1260638710951002116?s=19 
Nick
Durham
[email protected]
Caz
  • Caz
  • Advanced Member
17 May 2020 19:48:40

Originally Posted by: Justin W 


There is an opportunity to change the way that society and the human world works. It is a once-in-a-generation chance to ditch the fixation on 'economic growth' and build a greener, fairer, happier society where the obsession with stuff and doing better than your neighbours no longer counts.


We have a chance.


But of course it won't happen. The elastic snaps back. Resumption of normal service is the order of the day. It is the most depressing missed opportunity of my lifetime. So today I have donated to Extinction Rebellion and offered my services.


  Agree completely, except for your last sentence!   Society has been so much more ‘human’ over the past few weeks. 


Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Join the fun and banter of the monthly CET competition.
Devonian
17 May 2020 19:48:44

Originally Posted by: Essan 




I wasn't referring to you   


Hopefully my Govt compensation for being banned from working will come through next week (application went through smoothly) so I will be able to pay my council tax next week (much of which goes towards council workers' pensions ..... )



No, it really doesn't...besides, a job in public service is open to you.


You should have been able to work then? If so, then presumably so should every one else? Then, hundreds of thousands will have died. Is that the choice you would have made?


What would several hundred thousand people dying in a few months have done to us? Just wave all the death away as necessary or something? We'd have lost a lot of humanity AND our humanity. IMO.


"When it takes nearly 900,000 votes to elect one party’s MP, and just 26,000 for another, you know something is deeply wrong."

The electoral reform society, 14,12,19
NickR
17 May 2020 19:49:06

Originally Posted by: bledur 


 


 Wikipedia, yes that must be true.



Strangely, wikipedia is not entirely lacking in accuracy. Why are you such a twit?


Nick
Durham
[email protected]
NickR
17 May 2020 19:52:41

Originally Posted by: Essan 


 


My apologies.  I though this was the Covid 19 thread.   

Anyway,  look forward to you only posting weather related comments on TWO from now on.  



You know full well that wasnt what I said, implied or otherwise. Your assumptions about me and others are despicable. You have zero idea what is going on in my life and that of my family. Maybe if you did you wouldn't have posted the presumptuous, self-righteous sh it you did today.


And yeah, you've touched a nerve.


Nick
Durham
[email protected]
bledur
17 May 2020 19:54:21

Originally Posted by: Justin W 


 


I really wonder what happened to you, Andy. I haven't worked for two months - like you, I'm self employed. I have applied for the HMG self employment support scheme and am waiting for the money. This is the most worrying time of my life. But, hey, according to you I have 'unlimited money'


Why can you not write at this time ? I would have thought it was something you can do.The Self Employment scheme is very quick and efficient from what i have heard . My wife has applied but i did not think i had been so affected to apply.

Devonian
17 May 2020 19:55:38

Originally Posted by: Caz 


  Agree completely, except for your last sentence!   Society has been so much more ‘human’ over the past few weeks. 



I don't get why people are against XR - especially now. They're just people campaigning for a better world (ok, many of them are 'dangerous' Quakers).


The cars, smog, particulates,  etc etc etc will be back. INactivity wont change that.


"When it takes nearly 900,000 votes to elect one party’s MP, and just 26,000 for another, you know something is deeply wrong."

The electoral reform society, 14,12,19
Maunder Minimum
17 May 2020 19:56:57

Been busy today, so no idea whether this article has been posted before - apologies if so:


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/bma-got-science-wrong-in-urging-schools-to-stay-closed-7htwrggjr


"The largest doctors’ union has been criticised for saying that it is too early to consider opening schools, with other experts accusing it of making errors in its representation of scientific studies from other countries.


The British Medical Association wrote an open letter on Friday to the National Education Union, which represents teachers, supporting its opposition to government plans to reopen schools on June 1.


Chaand Nagpaul, BMA chairman, wrote that the little evidence so far on the potential dangers posed by reopening schools was conflicting and that the teaching unions had been “absolutely right” to urge caution.


“Until we have got case numbers much lower, we should not consider reopening schools,” he said.


Other experts took issue with the comments. “The BMA have caused headlines by focusing on the wrong part of the debate and by doing so have not presented a balanced representation of their members’ views,” Saul Faust, professor of paediatric immunology and infectious diseases at Southampton University and University Hospital Southampton, said.


He added: “Society has to reopen, children need to return to school as there are negatives for many of having to stay at home and we need to be able to study transmission dynamics in all ages to help us learn how to manage this virus.


“Slowly opening schools in a controlled way will be of low risk to children’s health and less risk to teachers than the risk to many other workers when on public transport.”


 


...


Alasdair Munro, clinical research fellow in paediatric infectious diseases at University Hospital, said that the letter contained “clear errors in interpretation of the evidence of transmission in children”.


He added: “The German study examining viral loads did not find children were ‘just as likely to be infected as adults’. It made no comment on this at all, but did find substantially lower numbers of children positive for SARS-CoV-2 in the cohort.


“In addition, the study did not demonstrate children are ‘just as infectious’ as adults. The study made no firm conclusions, but did find viral load increased with age . . . Whilst not the sole indicator of how infectious an individual is, this certainly does not indicate children are as infectious as adults.”


Catherine Carroll-Meehan, head of the school of education and sociology at the University of Portsmouth, said: “Given that we are in warmer months, a compromise might be to have children return to education and use outdoor learning spaces, parks, playgrounds in addition to the classroom. The Danish have recently opened schools and applied social distancing effectively.


..."


As I have written previously, the BMA getting involved in this is suspect and from the outset Chaand Nagpaul, BMA chairman appears to have been one sided in his attitude to the way the crisis has been handled in the UK. Sure, he has to represent the Doctors who are members of the BMA, but a lot of that requires engaging with the authorities, rather than just posturing and throwing rotten eggs and tomatoes in public.


New world order coming.
bledur
17 May 2020 19:56:57

Originally Posted by: NickR 


 


Strangely, wikipedia is not entirely lacking in accuracy. Why are you such a twit?



 Well so i have been informed, so perhaps it is better. On the second part of your comment i will just put down to you having a bad day.

Devonian
17 May 2020 20:00:08

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 


Been busy today, so no idea whether this article has been posted before - apologies if so:


...



Posted by you earlier today...


Edit: No it wasn't , but same old claptrap as in the Mail you did cut-n-paste earlier


"When it takes nearly 900,000 votes to elect one party’s MP, and just 26,000 for another, you know something is deeply wrong."

The electoral reform society, 14,12,19
Bugglesgate
17 May 2020 20:01:06

Originally Posted by: Devonian 


 


Yup, spot on.


Clean air, no noise, animals, plants and birds less harassed, quiet...


No, we've got to get back to pollution, noise, cars, smog, plastic, wasting money on tat, fecking about everywhere in planes,  drugs, chucking things in dustbins, takeaways, not caring about anything. I dunno...


Still, I've vowed to ride to work more and I'm damn well going to do that.



 


Was up on the downs this morning early (6:30 AM) it was great (for a while) sun, skylarks - utterly tranquil.


........ Then  about 7.30 AM  some utter dick head woke up and decided to  rag his  motor bicycle   without a silencer up and down the A339.  He must have been 6 miles away at the nearest but the sound was annoying and intrusive - God alone what it must have sounded like in the valley adjacent to the road.


The sound of normality returning


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
NickR
17 May 2020 20:02:04

Originally Posted by: bledur 


 


 Well so i have been informed, so perhaps it is better. On the second part of your comment i will just put down to you having a bad day.



Does wikipedia get his qualifications, field, and career details right? Yes. Full stop.


Nick
Durham
[email protected]
Maunder Minimum
17 May 2020 20:02:55

Originally Posted by: Devonian 


 


Posted by you earlier today...



Nope - only read that article this evening - the piece I posted this morning was from the Daily Wail.


Anyhow, what have we got here?


https://events.labour.org.uk/event/99382


"...


The doors will be open for stalls, coffee and registration from 10am, to ensure a prompt start. The broad themes and demands of the conference will be the same as those that galvanised hundreds of thousands at #ourNHS demo:

No Cuts or Closures
No Privatisation
Fair Pay for NHS staff

We have an exciting platform of speakers confirmed from leading trade unions and councillors to local campaigners and life-long activists, including:

Dr Chaand Nagpaul, Chair of BMA
Sara Gorton, head of Unison health
Ken Loach, BAFTA award winning film director
Julian Bell and Steven Cowan, Council Leaders who have rejected STPs in London


..."


I long suspected there was a political angle to the head of the BMA.


New world order coming.
Devonian
17 May 2020 20:02:57

Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 


 


 


Was up on the downs this morning early (6:30 AM) it was great (for a while) sun, skylarks - utterly tranquil.


........ Then  about 7.30 AM  some utter dick head woke up and decided to  rag his  motor bicycle   without a silencer up and down the A339.  He must have been 6 miles away at the nearest but the sound was annoying and intrusive - God alone what it must have sounded like in the valley adjacent to the road.


The sound of normality returning



Yes, some bloody motorbikes and the lard brains who ride some of them.


"When it takes nearly 900,000 votes to elect one party’s MP, and just 26,000 for another, you know something is deeply wrong."

The electoral reform society, 14,12,19
Essan
17 May 2020 20:03:58

Originally Posted by: Devonian 


You should have been able to work then? If so, then presumably so should every one else? Then, hundreds of thousands will have died. Is that the choice you would have made?




I wasn't saying that.   I simply consider the payment to be compensation, rather than a hand-out.   


 


Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
Joe Bloggs
17 May 2020 20:04:56

Funny how things go round in circles in this place. 


I remember having an argument with Andy (Essan) on this forum about whether or not I was wealthy, over ten years ago now. 😂😂 


 



Manchester City Centre, 31m ASL

Devonian
17 May 2020 20:06:41

Originally Posted by: Essan 





I wasn't saying that.   I simply consider the payment to be compensation, rather than a hand-out.   


 



Ahh, ok, got you.


"When it takes nearly 900,000 votes to elect one party’s MP, and just 26,000 for another, you know something is deeply wrong."

The electoral reform society, 14,12,19
Essan
17 May 2020 20:06:54

Originally Posted by: NickR 


 


You know full well that wasnt what I said, implied or otherwise. Your assumptions about me and others are despicable. You have zero idea what is going on in my life and that of my family. Maybe if you did you wouldn't have posted the presumptuous, self-righteous sh it you did today.


And yeah, you've touched a nerve.





Whereas you presume to know everything about me and anyone else whom you disagree with.

Pot Kettle Black



And in case you didn't know it, you touched a nerve too.  And not for the first time 



Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
Northern Sky
17 May 2020 20:12:27

Originally Posted by: Devonian 


 


I don't get why people are against XR - especially now. They're just people campaigning for a better world (ok, many of them are 'dangerous' Quakers).


The cars, smog, particulates,  etc etc etc will be back. INactivity wont change that.



Nothing wrong with campaigning for a better world. The problem with XR is they are hypocrites. How many of them would be prepared to live in the poverty they want to keep billions of other people in? There's absolutely nothing stopping them giving away all their money and belongings and living in a hut with the rest of their family and dying from indoor air pollution because they have no other option but to burn wood or dung for fuel. If they want to stop people using the resources that lift them out of that poverty the least they can do is live in it themselves.


And yes I've loved the quiet, the clean air and the birdsong during lockdown but a big part of that has been a result of people not being able to work and earn money to survive. We can't just stop people working but hopefully many people will have found they can work in a different way through technology. Economic growth isn't the problem, the problem is the mismanagement of resources. Maybe we will learn some lessons from lockdown?

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