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patricia Offline
#241 Posted : 13 March 2012 17:22:49(UTC)
patricia

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Location: North West Kent

Originally Posted by: Gavin D Go to Quoted Post


£1,000 FINE FOR USING HOSEPIPE


HOUSEHOLDERS will face £1,000 fines if they use a hosepipe as part of plans to avert Britain’s worst drought for 124 years.


Companies have the power to impose the penalty under Section 76 of the Water Industry Act 1991, which states: “Any person contravening a water use prohibition shall be guilty of an offence and liable to a fine not exceeding £1,000.”

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/307789/-1-000-fine-for-using-hosepipe


 

Good, I am glad, why should some people think the rules apply to everyone else but not to them

Edited by user 13 March 2012 17:26:18(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

danm Offline
#242 Posted : 13 March 2012 17:45:58(UTC)
danm

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 30/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: NE London

Rainfall totals (mm) for the whole of 2011 (for selected places around the UK I could actually find statistics for):

 

Heathrow: 494.05mm

Woodford (just south of Manchester): 799.12mm

Aviemore: 1145.04mm ()

Benson (Oxfordshire): 475.45mm

Bedford: 379.52mm

Belfast (Aldergrove Airport): 854.82mm

Andrewsfield (Essex): 453.72mm

Carlisle: 1013.15mm ()

Blackpool: 839.98mm

Charlwood (Surrey): 571.33mm

Coleshill (Warwickshire): 410.78mm

Edinburgh: 942.66mm

Exeter: 602.81mm

Eskdalemuir (Dumfries and Galloway, Scotland): 2191.55mm ()

Glasgow: 1792.20mm ()

Hawarden (Flintshire, north Wales): 479.19mm

Hereford: 489.63mm

Kinloss (Moray, north-east Scotland): 705.66mm

Nottingham: 432.11mm

Plymouth: 787.04mm

Isle of Skye: 2473.66mm ()

Stornoway (Outer Hebridies): 1256.06mm ()

Wattisham (Suffolk): 467.69mm

Weybourne (Norfolk): 405.58mm

Osprey Offline
#243 Posted : 13 March 2012 17:55:19(UTC)
Osprey

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Joined: 14/07/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1,022

Originally Posted by: DEW Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Steam Fog Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post

With levels of immigration in recent decades and of migration to the SE of England from other parts of the UK, I always had my doubts whether this country could survive another 1976.

Perhaps we will find out this year. But it is as plain as your nose that population pressures and increased population density means more use of resources, including water.

I'm fairly confident the country will "survive"?? Or do you think it's all Mad Max from here on in?

Immigration? or prosperity? How many swimming pools and automatic watering systems have been installewd in the last 25 years? I'd put my money on that as an even bigger effect than population increase.

Anyway, Accuweather is forecasting another 23mm for here for Sunday, which should help - pity that it's coming at the weekend though.

 

Spare a thought for S France and E Spain - according to the forecaster on the BBC News 24 last night, they've only had 25 - 30% of normal winter rainfall, compared to SE England 60-70%.

Once a pool is installed apart from the initial filling the pools are never emptied except to backwash the pool filter and is lowered to below the skimmer and returns for winterising
 
Evaporation is negligible on account of heat retention covers Most pools are closed down mis autum to mid spring depending

Usually the pool overfills in the winter and has to be pumped out to reduce the level back down

 

POD Offline
#244 Posted : 13 March 2012 20:40:07(UTC)
POD

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Location: Caterham-on-the-Hill, North Downs, Surrey 189m asl

Not a great shortage here, the rain fell in the wrong places presumably, or at the wrong time, as hosepipe ban starts April 5th.
689mm for 2011, average 794mm
774mm 2010. 

Pat.
patricia Offline
#245 Posted : 13 March 2012 20:56:48(UTC)
patricia

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Posts: 576
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Location: North West Kent

It will be relatively easy for people to be found out for using hosepipes during a ban, there will always be neighbours  who will take pictures on their mobiles.

Edited by user 13 March 2012 22:13:22(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

mbrothers Offline
#246 Posted : 13 March 2012 22:02:47(UTC)
mbrothers

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 23/10/2008(UTC)
Posts: 568

[quote=patricia;308785]

It will be relatively easy for people to be found out for using hosepipes during a ban, there will always be neighbours  who will take pictures on thier mobiles.

[/quote britain in bloom could be thrown into chaos this year. wtf . im gonna pee in my hanging baskets.

newquay
Essan Offline
#247 Posted : 14 March 2012 10:05:58(UTC)
Essan

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Posts: 14,715
Antarctica
Location: in a cave ... Evesham, Worcs

Just looking again at the regional figures comparing 2010/12 with 1975/6 - worth noting that the Nov 10 - Feb 12 rainfall figure for Evesham is just 508.8mm which is 61% of the 61-90 average.

Andy

Weather & Earth Science News

"Getting entangled with humans clouds the thinking" - Death

Walk the Worcestershire Way - 29 June 2013 - in aid of Vasculitis UK
The Beast from the East Offline
#248 Posted : 14 March 2012 11:56:02(UTC)
The Beast from the East

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Location: Purley, Surrey

Originally Posted by: patricia Go to Quoted Post

It will be relatively easy for people to be found out for using hosepipes during a ban, there will always be neighbours  who will take pictures on their mobiles.

But it would be difficult to prove in court that the footage was taken when it was claimed to be taken, besides people who flout the ban tend to do it under the cover of darkness.

Anyway, plenty of rain possible this weekend which will keep gardeners happy for a while longer

 

Caz Offline
#249 Posted : 14 March 2012 12:15:28(UTC)
Caz

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Location: Market Warsop, Nottinghamshire, East Midlands

Originally Posted by: danm Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Essan Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: danm Go to Quoted Post

Graphic from The Telegraph showing rainfall amounts in the SE in February 2012, the last 5 months, the last 17 months and also current groundwater levels. Very interesting:

Click the tabs at the top of the graphic to skip through each of the time periods: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/9140456/Graphic-South-East-England-water-levels-and-drought-mapped.html



And, as per the map in the MetO blog, the SE has had a quite a lot more rain over the past 17 months than much of the Midlands!    And most of us have had more than in 75/76.

Which goes to show, it's not just lack of rain in the SE.   Although I recall saying many, many, years ago that the only way the SE could sustain it's demand for water was if every year had above average rainfall - even average rainfall every year would not be enough in the long run. 

I blame it on all the breweries

I'd be interested to see if the SE actually has had more rain than the Midlands. The Midlands rainfall totals have been even more below average than some parts of the SE, but is the normal annual rainfall totals higher in the Midlands than the SE? If that is the case then the SE may actually have seen less rain than the Midlands, but the deviation from the mean may just be less than it currently is in parts of the Midlands. 

I have no idea of the answer myself. 

The meto blog say's  "several Midland counties – such as Shropshire, Nottinghamshire, Leicestershire and Warwickshire – had their driest year on record".   Last year was the first time I'd seen farmers irrigating fields from Spring right through to Autumn and if things don't change soon, the irrigation pipes will be out again next month.  The way we're going in Nottinghamshire, we'll be having another record dry year.

Why does the Telegraph article only show the SE, when we in the East Midlands are struggling with rainfall totals as well?

Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Grant's Puffin Cam
Maunder Minimum Offline
#250 Posted : 14 March 2012 12:20:18(UTC)
Maunder Minimum

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Location: Copenhagen (work) and West Worcestershire (home)

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East Go to Quoted Post
trust Maunder to blame it on the immigrants! Anyway I don't have a water meter so I will defy the ban and continue to water when it's dark, after the curtain twitchers next door have gone to bed! Lol

Not blaming it on immigrants - but demographic pressures undoubtedly play a role in use of resources.

Unfortunately, the most densely populated region of England, is also that which is driest.

Something has to give!
Public spending cuts now, are a result of Brown's lack of prudence as Chancellor and PM.
Maunder Minimum Offline
#251 Posted : 14 March 2012 12:23:16(UTC)
Maunder Minimum

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Location: Copenhagen (work) and West Worcestershire (home)

Originally Posted by: Romfordman Go to Quoted Post

I wonder whether I should buy another water butte, I have been prevaricating about it for a while now, I already have 2 and although I will use them a lot in the summer if I can its only really for about 4 monthsd use. Can I really justify spending £30

what does anyone reckon, are we really going to see stand pipes in the street. as I live at the top of a hill. Water pressure is going to be a problem, I could use water butte water to flush the toilets, am I over reacting.  



We have a well in the garden - last weekend, I went to Machine Mart and purchased a well pump. I am going to install it next weekend, so our garden watering issues will hopefully be solved.

Will let you know if it works.
Public spending cuts now, are a result of Brown's lack of prudence as Chancellor and PM.
danm Offline
#252 Posted : 14 March 2012 13:03:11(UTC)
danm

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 30/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: NE London

Originally Posted by: Caz Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: danm Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Essan Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: danm Go to Quoted Post

Graphic from The Telegraph showing rainfall amounts in the SE in February 2012, the last 5 months, the last 17 months and also current groundwater levels. Very interesting:

Click the tabs at the top of the graphic to skip through each of the time periods: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/9140456/Graphic-South-East-England-water-levels-and-drought-mapped.html



And, as per the map in the MetO blog, the SE has had a quite a lot more rain over the past 17 months than much of the Midlands!    And most of us have had more than in 75/76.

Which goes to show, it's not just lack of rain in the SE.   Although I recall saying many, many, years ago that the only way the SE could sustain it's demand for water was if every year had above average rainfall - even average rainfall every year would not be enough in the long run. 

I blame it on all the breweries

I'd be interested to see if the SE actually has had more rain than the Midlands. The Midlands rainfall totals have been even more below average than some parts of the SE, but is the normal annual rainfall totals higher in the Midlands than the SE? If that is the case then the SE may actually have seen less rain than the Midlands, but the deviation from the mean may just be less than it currently is in parts of the Midlands. 

I have no idea of the answer myself. 

The meto blog say's  "several Midland counties – such as Shropshire, Nottinghamshire, Leicestershire and Warwickshire – had their driest year on record".   Last year was the first time I'd seen farmers irrigating fields from Spring right through to Autumn and if things don't change soon, the irrigation pipes will be out again next month.  The way we're going in Nottinghamshire, we'll be having another record dry year.

Why does the Telegraph article only show the SE, when we in the East Midlands are struggling with rainfall totals as well?

I think because the hosepipe bans are being enforced in the SE. I don't think hosepipe bans have yet been implemented in the Midlands. Doesn't mean that the Midlands isn't suffering just as badly or worse than the SE, just that I think there is more demand for water in the SE due to the high population density, so hosepipe bans are needed more here to preserve the existing supply.

Caz Offline
#253 Posted : 14 March 2012 13:13:14(UTC)
Caz

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 28/10/2008(UTC)
Posts: 9,165
Woman
Location: Market Warsop, Nottinghamshire, East Midlands

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Romfordman Go to Quoted Post

I wonder whether I should buy another water butte, I have been prevaricating about it for a while now, I already have 2 and although I will use them a lot in the summer if I can its only really for about 4 monthsd use. Can I really justify spending £30

what does anyone reckon, are we really going to see stand pipes in the street. as I live at the top of a hill. Water pressure is going to be a problem, I could use water butte water to flush the toilets, am I over reacting.  

We have a well in the garden - last weekend, I went to Machine Mart and purchased a well pump. I am going to install it next weekend, so our garden watering issues will hopefully be solved. Will let you know if it works.

That's interesting!  Do you know how far down the water level is? 

My daughter was renovating a house last year and her builder found a well that had been capped.  We managed to uncover a small part but dropping stones down it gave us no clue to its depth as they were bouncing off the well sides until we couldn't hear them but we never heard a splash.  Her house is on top of a ridge, level with the roof of our house, which is at river level, so groundwater will be a long way down.  Sadly, we had to re-cap it because it's right where her drive extension was being built. 

Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Grant's Puffin Cam
Devonian Online
#254 Posted : 14 March 2012 13:21:35(UTC)
Devonian

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 02/05/2006(UTC)
Posts: 11,040
Man
Location: SE Devon

Originally Posted by: Caz Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Romfordman Go to Quoted Post

I wonder whether I should buy another water butte, I have been prevaricating about it for a while now, I already have 2 and although I will use them a lot in the summer if I can its only really for about 4 monthsd use. Can I really justify spending £30

what does anyone reckon, are we really going to see stand pipes in the street. as I live at the top of a hill. Water pressure is going to be a problem, I could use water butte water to flush the toilets, am I over reacting.  

We have a well in the garden - last weekend, I went to Machine Mart and purchased a well pump. I am going to install it next weekend, so our garden watering issues will hopefully be solved. Will let you know if it works.

That's interesting!  Do you know how far down the water level is? 

My daughter was renovating a house last year and her builder found a well that had been capped.  We managed to uncover a small part but dropping stones down it gave us no clue to its depth as they were bouncing off the well sides until we couldn't hear them but we never heard a splash.  Her house is on top of a ridge, level with the roof of our house, which is at river level, so groundwater will be a long way down.  Sadly, we had to re-cap it because it's right where her drive extension was being built. 

A relative has a well in her garden in Kent. Last year we got a (small, 12V pump) pump but even then that water was so far down (more than 5m down) the pump couldn't move it... 

Caz Offline
#255 Posted : 14 March 2012 14:40:16(UTC)
Caz

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Joined: 28/10/2008(UTC)
Posts: 9,165
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Location: Market Warsop, Nottinghamshire, East Midlands

Originally Posted by: Devonian Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Caz Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Romfordman Go to Quoted Post

I wonder whether I should buy another water butte, I have been prevaricating about it for a while now, I already have 2 and although I will use them a lot in the summer if I can its only really for about 4 monthsd use. Can I really justify spending £30

what does anyone reckon, are we really going to see stand pipes in the street. as I live at the top of a hill. Water pressure is going to be a problem, I could use water butte water to flush the toilets, am I over reacting.  

We have a well in the garden - last weekend, I went to Machine Mart and purchased a well pump. I am going to install it next weekend, so our garden watering issues will hopefully be solved. Will let you know if it works.

That's interesting!  Do you know how far down the water level is? 

My daughter was renovating a house last year and her builder found a well that had been capped.  We managed to uncover a small part but dropping stones down it gave us no clue to its depth as they were bouncing off the well sides until we couldn't hear them but we never heard a splash.  Her house is on top of a ridge, level with the roof of our house, which is at river level, so groundwater will be a long way down.  Sadly, we had to re-cap it because it's right where her drive extension was being built. 

A relative has a well in her garden in Kent. Last year we got a (small, 12V pump) pump but even then that water was so far down (more than 5m down) the pump couldn't move it... 

We tried to measure the depth of Gemma's well but our 30 foot measure wasn't long enough.  We only knew the well was there when the ground around the side of it gave way to reveal the outside brickwork, which was very fancy.  A gutter from a lean-to had been washing soil into the well over the years and had left a void around it.  I'd have really liked to make a feature of it but it was right on her boundary and so deep it could have been dangerous.  We had considered filling it in but despite all the building rubble from walls that had been knocked down in the house, we still wouldn't have had enough to fill it. 

Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Grant's Puffin Cam
Sevendust Offline
#256 Posted : 14 March 2012 14:49:33(UTC)
Sevendust

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 05/04/2006(UTC)
Posts: 30,928
Location: Alton, Hampshire

I just had a look at the Winchester site to check the rainfall stats.  The years 2007-2009 were certainly much wetter than the last 2 although I don't know what the long term average is as the station only started in 2006. The total for 2011 is higher than that for 2010 and not really that dry IMO.

Stats:-

2007 - 874.9mm   2008 - 830.0mm   2009 - 851.7mm   2010   606.1mm   2011   710.0mm

Edited by user 14 March 2012 16:44:24(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Dave

Alton - deep in the Hampshire Alps

Caz Offline
#257 Posted : 14 March 2012 14:52:34(UTC)
Caz

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 28/10/2008(UTC)
Posts: 9,165
Woman
Location: Market Warsop, Nottinghamshire, East Midlands

I know quite a few people who have installed automatic irrigation systems in their gardens in the past couple of years.  I don't know how the water authorities will view them or regulate their use, but I'd think they use just as much water as hosepipes, if not more.

Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Grant's Puffin Cam
Essan Offline
#258 Posted : 14 March 2012 15:12:20(UTC)
Essan

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 05/04/2006(UTC)
Posts: 14,715
Antarctica
Location: in a cave ... Evesham, Worcs

Originally Posted by: Caz Go to Quoted Post

I know quite a few people who have installed automatic irrigation systems in their gardens in the past couple of years.  I don't know how the water authorities will view them or regulate their use, but I'd think they use just as much water as hosepipes, if not more.

Sprinkler systems are also banned.  I guess more elaborate and expensive irrigation systems are not specifically mentioned because few normal people have them - it's usually only show gardens and the like.  But I would expect them to also be banned. 

But using the watercan is not only still legal it's also good exercise,  And cheaper than the gym


 

Andy

Weather & Earth Science News

"Getting entangled with humans clouds the thinking" - Death

Walk the Worcestershire Way - 29 June 2013 - in aid of Vasculitis UK
Maunder Minimum Offline
#259 Posted : 14 March 2012 16:06:22(UTC)
Maunder Minimum

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Joined: 08/09/2007(UTC)
Posts: 16,585
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Location: Copenhagen (work) and West Worcestershire (home)

Originally Posted by: Caz Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Romfordman Go to Quoted Post

I wonder whether I should buy another water butte, I have been prevaricating about it for a while now, I already have 2 and although I will use them a lot in the summer if I can its only really for about 4 monthsd use. Can I really justify spending £30

what does anyone reckon, are we really going to see stand pipes in the street. as I live at the top of a hill. Water pressure is going to be a problem, I could use water butte water to flush the toilets, am I over reacting.  

We have a well in the garden - last weekend, I went to Machine Mart and purchased a well pump. I am going to install it next weekend, so our garden watering issues will hopefully be solved. Will let you know if it works.

That's interesting!  Do you know how far down the water level is? 

My daughter was renovating a house last year and her builder found a well that had been capped.  We managed to uncover a small part but dropping stones down it gave us no clue to its depth as they were bouncing off the well sides until we couldn't hear them but we never heard a splash.  Her house is on top of a ridge, level with the roof of our house, which is at river level, so groundwater will be a long way down.  Sadly, we had to re-cap it because it's right where her drive extension was being built. 



I have measured the distance to the water level and it is 40 feet. The well has a metal grid over it, which I shall have to unbolt and remove, to lower in the pump. If it works, I shall of course replace the grid over it for safety reasons.
Public spending cuts now, are a result of Brown's lack of prudence as Chancellor and PM.
Caz Offline
#260 Posted : 14 March 2012 16:35:57(UTC)
Caz

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 28/10/2008(UTC)
Posts: 9,165
Woman
Location: Market Warsop, Nottinghamshire, East Midlands

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Caz Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Romfordman Go to Quoted Post

I wonder whether I should buy another water butte, I have been prevaricating about it for a while now, I already have 2 and although I will use them a lot in the summer if I can its only really for about 4 monthsd use. Can I really justify spending £30

what does anyone reckon, are we really going to see stand pipes in the street. as I live at the top of a hill. Water pressure is going to be a problem, I could use water butte water to flush the toilets, am I over reacting.  

We have a well in the garden - last weekend, I went to Machine Mart and purchased a well pump. I am going to install it next weekend, so our garden watering issues will hopefully be solved. Will let you know if it works.

That's interesting!  Do you know how far down the water level is? 

My daughter was renovating a house last year and her builder found a well that had been capped.  We managed to uncover a small part but dropping stones down it gave us no clue to its depth as they were bouncing off the well sides until we couldn't hear them but we never heard a splash.  Her house is on top of a ridge, level with the roof of our house, which is at river level, so groundwater will be a long way down.  Sadly, we had to re-cap it because it's right where her drive extension was being built. 

I have measured the distance to the water level and it is 40 feet. The well has a metal grid over it, which I shall have to unbolt and remove, to lower in the pump. If it works, I shall of course replace the grid over it for safety reasons.

Sounds an exciting and worthwhile project!  Good luck and let us know how you get on! 

Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Grant's Puffin Cam
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